Trains arriving simultaneously at Harrow-on-the-Hill

[ruislip]

A question or two about slows and fasts/semi-fasts arriving simultaneously at HOTH(both up and down). Was this practice started in MR days, or did it commence in the LT era? Does this practice continue today, even though fasts and semi-fasts only run in the peaks? Are the "super-fast" trains that used to operate in the peak flow direction between Chesham and the city still on the timetable (the ones that non-stop HOTH)?

[superteacher]

Mar 25, 2017 21:52:52 GMT ruislip said:

A question or two about slows and fasts/semi-fasts arriving simultaneously at HOTH(both up and down). Was this practice started in MR days, or did it commence in the LT era? Does this practice continue today, even though fasts and semi-fasts only run in the peaks? Are the "super-fast" trains that used to operate in the peak flow direction between Chesham and the city still on the timetable (the ones that non-stop HOTH)?

There are no longer any trains which are booked to non-stop Harrow on the Hill. It's been quite a few years since they were removed from the timetable.

[londoner]

Mar 25, 2017 21:52:52 GMT ruislip said:

A question or two about slows and fasts/semi-fasts arriving simultaneously at HOTH(both up and down). Was this practice started in MR days, or did it commence in the LT era? Does this practice continue today, even though fasts and semi-fasts only run in the peaks? Are the "super-fast" trains that used to operate in the peak flow direction between Chesham and the city still on the timetable (the ones that non-stop HOTH)?

My experience is that they don't arrive at the same time, but due to driver changes, the slow and fast trains may sometimes be on platforms at the same time anyway, allowing for interchange. If two slow trains are on both platforms, the drivers usually do a good job in informing passengers of the next departing train. 

For southbound morning peak journeys on the Met line, many people will get off the slow train on platform 5 and wait for the fast trains on platform 6. If both a slow and fast train are on platform 5 and 6 respectively, an interchanging passenger will save around 3-4 minutes by the time they get to Finchley Road, which may be higher if they need to use the Jubilee line and are also able to immediately catch it at Finchley Road. My experience is that the drivers of most Jubilee Line trains do not bother waiting to allow interchange. This is probably because the Jubilee Line is highly frequent, about every 2 mins, so the wait isn't long. On the northbound journey, people will often wait for the fast/ semi fast services at Baker Street/ Finchley Road, even if it saves only 2-3 minutes because of the stop at Wembley Park. However, some people will also get on board an empty train at Baker Street (Platforms 1 or 4) for a seat. 

All Metropolitan Line trains stop at Harrow-on-the-Hill (HoTH) without exception. A few peak Chiltern Railway services (going into London in the morning and out of London in the evening) do not call at the station. Not many people in my experience, who are travelling southbound into London in the morning, will get off a Met line train to catch a Chiltern train, presumably because most want Baker St or Jubilee Line services. Assuming a Met train arrives on platform 5/6 going into London, if someone uses the subway to then catch a southbound Chiltern railway train, with minimal waiting time, this saves about 8 minutes getting into London I believe, but the Chiltern trains sometimes have a delay finding a vacant platform at Marylebone. You also lose some of the time, particularly if the train terminates on platform 6 at Marylebone, because of the long walk to the gate barriers. I don't know how many people get off a southbound Chiltern train at HoTH to get a Met train into central London, I suspect not many. Regarding the northbound services in the evening, a large number of people do take the Chiltern trains, and get off at HoTH, either to exit or interchange for platforms 4/5 into Uxbride/ Watford branches. 

[kesmet]

How many peak fast services non-stop at Wembley Park? When I was commuting through there (early 2000s) it was quite common to see people standing up, getting ready to exit the train at Wembley Park, only to have it sail straight through and continue to Harrow on the Hill. But that became a rare(r) occurrence towards the end of my time commuting that way (mid 2000s).

Trains from the north of Harrow can arrive simultaneously - but only if one's come from the Uxbridge branch, as trains from the fast tracks have to cross over to what was the slow track, just north of the Uxbridge dive-under.

[Deleted]

Mar 29, 2017 23:01:05 GMT kesmet said:

How many peak fast services non-stop at Wembley Park? When I was commuting through there (early 2000s) it was quite common to see people standing up, getting ready to exit the train at Wembley Park, only to have it sail straight through and continue to Harrow on the Hill. But that became a rare(r) occurrence towards the end of my time commuting that way (mid 2000s).

If everything's running to time, none on the northbound.

[kesmet]

Thanks, tut. (I suppose I really should look at the WTT, really, if I want to know more!).

[MoreToJack]

You do sometimes get simultaneous arrivals at Harrow-on-the-Hill...!

Leaf fall 2015, with thanks to the two drivers involved for the 'tip-off' to be in the right place at the right time!


21048 & 5111 - Harrow-on-the-Hill by Jack Gordon, on Flickr