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Post by howda62 on Oct 28, 2018 9:45:45 GMT
Following reports at the start of the year that Amersham station was due to have step-free work commencing later in the year, I was pleased to see a poster now up at the station indicating lift installation work is due to commence this week (31st October).
There was of course an aborted attempt at lift installation back in 2009, with a good deal of work being undertaken before the work was abandoned (at Amersham and at some other stations also with step-free work underway) due to a funding shortfall. The other recent news that Crossrail needs loads of extra money does make me slightly concerned that another abandonment may yet still happen on this second attempt. Fingers crossed.
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Post by aslefshrugged on Oct 28, 2018 10:08:44 GMT
Due to a funding shortfall? TfL had enough money for the Boris bus, the cable car, the cycle superhighways, the garden bridge and promoting Boris Island.
Step free access was cancelled at six stations in 2009 after millions had been spent on preparation work; Amersham (£4.6m), Greenford (£3.9m), Ladbroke Grove (£3.06m), Newbury Park (£4.6m), Osterley (£3.9m) and West Kensington (£5.05m). In addition step free access at Shepherd's Bush was cancelled after £39m had been spent because they discovered that gas and water pipes weren't where they thought they were.
Greenford went step free in 2015, Newbury Park will be step free next year and Osterley by 2020 (but they are in London, Amersham isn't).
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Post by knap on Oct 28, 2018 12:16:41 GMT
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Post by norbitonflyer on Oct 28, 2018 16:26:01 GMT
Due to a funding shortfall? TfL had enough money for the Boris bus, the cable car, the cycle superhighways, the garden bridge and promoting Boris Island. After spending on al those vanity projects, is it surprising there was a shortfall for funding on the boring day-to-day stuff? |
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Post by howda62 on Oct 28, 2018 16:31:50 GMT
Due to a funding shortfall? Without checking back on details before I posted, that is how I remembered the situation - TfL not having enough budget to cover all the work it wanted/needed to undertake, and that funds for these elements would be re-purposed for other projects or activities that were now more important. Having now checked, from the TfL Business Plan for 2010/11 through 2017/18 that was published for review in October 2009, the actual reason cited there is: which kind of makes sense. knap, thanks for those planning links I'll take a look. |
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Post by stapler on Oct 28, 2018 16:48:22 GMT
Due to a funding shortfall? TfL had enough money for the Boris bus, the cable car, the cycle superhighways, the garden bridge and promoting Boris Island. Step free access was cancelled at six stations in 2009 after millions had been spent on preparation work; Amersham (£4.6m), Greenford (£3.9m), Ladbroke Grove (£3.06m), Newbury Park (£4.6m), Osterley (£3.9m) and West Kensington (£5.05m). In addition step free access at Shepherd's Bush was cancelled after £39m had been spent because they discovered that gas and water pipes weren't where they thought they were. Greenford went step free in 2015, Newbury Park will be step free next year and Osterley by 2020 (but they are in London, Amersham isn't). Buckhurst Hill was done this year, and is outside Sadiq Island(aka Greater London). Debden is promised next year, ditto! |
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Post by patrickb on Oct 28, 2018 22:23:46 GMT
Having now checked, from the TfL Business Plan for 2010/11 through 2017/18 that was published for review in October 2009, the actual reason cited there is: Why would TfL invest in accessibility of stations that are in close proximity to existing step-free stations in the first place? Large sections of the Central, Metropolitan, Northern and Piccadilly Lines have no step free access. Stations should be selected and prioritised based on factors like: Areas they serve which may have fewer accessible stations. Whether these are Day / Night Tube Termini. Connections they provide to other services. Stations like Rayners Lane, Turnpike Lane, Kentish Town, White City and Leytonstone should be the ones to be prioritised. Granted, these may be less straightforward conversions, but you could argue that providing more step-free stations to areas that have less of them is money better spent. |
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Chris M
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Post by Chris M on Oct 28, 2018 23:24:48 GMT
I'm struggling to think how Leytonstone could be made step-free without very significant (and very significantly disruptive) rebuilding works. The ticket hall needs more capacity anyway, so it's probably best to wait until the practical considerations and finances allow you to do the whole job in one go. Even if funding weren't an issue I can't imagine this being possible until after Crossrail relieves some of the traffic, so all in all it's probably a good thing that they haven't spent the money on step-free access there yet. It also has bus connections with Stratford (fully step-free), Walthamstow Central (partially step-free) and South Woodford (works to make it fully step-free are currently in progress).
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Post by crusty54 on Oct 29, 2018 0:11:16 GMT
I'm struggling to think how Leytonstone could be made step-free without very significant (and very significantly disruptive) rebuilding works. The ticket hall needs more capacity anyway, so it's probably best to wait until the practical considerations and finances allow you to do the whole job in one go. Even if funding weren't an issue I can't imagine this being possible until after Crossrail relieves some of the traffic, so all in all it's probably a good thing that they haven't spent the money on step-free access there yet. It also has bus connections with Stratford (fully step-free), Walthamstow Central (partially step-free) and South Woodford (works to make it fully step-free are currently in progress). A ramp off the eastbound platform should be possible. |
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Post by aslefshrugged on Oct 29, 2018 2:36:05 GMT
Due to a funding shortfall? TfL had enough money for the Boris bus, the cable car, the cycle superhighways, the garden bridge and promoting Boris Island. After spending on al those vanity projects, is it surprising there was a shortfall for funding on the boring day-to-day stuff? Except the "boring day-to-day stuff" was cancelled before any spending on the vanity projects. |
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Post by aslefshrugged on Oct 29, 2018 2:47:11 GMT
Due to a funding shortfall? TfL had enough money for the Boris bus, the cable car, the cycle superhighways, the garden bridge and promoting Boris Island. Step free access was cancelled at six stations in 2009 after millions had been spent on preparation work; Amersham (£4.6m), Greenford (£3.9m), Ladbroke Grove (£3.06m), Newbury Park (£4.6m), Osterley (£3.9m) and West Kensington (£5.05m). In addition step free access at Shepherd's Bush was cancelled after £39m had been spent because they discovered that gas and water pipes weren't where they thought they were. Greenford went step free in 2015, Newbury Park will be step free next year and Osterley by 2020 (but they are in London, Amersham isn't). Buckhurst Hill was done this year, and is outside Sadiq Island(aka Greater London). Debden is promised next year, ditto! Buckhurst Hill was simply a case of fitting a couple of card readers by the existing entrances at the southern end of the platforms (western end for us drivers), resurfacing the ramps and fitting handrails which took just four months. The subway that goes under the track is owned by Epping Forest District Council so TfL's spending must have been minimal. As for Debden that presents a few problems so it will be interesting to see what the plans are. |
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Post by aslefshrugged on Oct 29, 2018 2:56:31 GMT
I'm struggling to think how Leytonstone could be made step-free without very significant (and very significantly disruptive) rebuilding works. The ticket hall needs more capacity anyway, so it's probably best to wait until the practical considerations and finances allow you to do the whole job in one go. Even if funding weren't an issue I can't imagine this being possible until after Crossrail relieves some of the traffic, so all in all it's probably a good thing that they haven't spent the money on step-free access there yet. It also has bus connections with Stratford (fully step-free), Walthamstow Central (partially step-free) and South Woodford (works to make it fully step-free are currently in progress). A ramp off the eastbound platform should be possible. Where to? The only way I can see making Leytonstone step free is with lifts, I doubt if there's room to tunnel under the track bed so you'd have to tunnel from the ticket hall along the north side of Platform 3, put one lift up to the platform (losing the offices behind the platform in the staff car park) then up to a bridge, over the track and another lift back down to Platforms 1 and 2. That would probably mean moving the gateline further towards the entrance and losing Perky Blenders. |
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Post by stapler on Oct 30, 2018 9:00:31 GMT
Buckhurst Hill was done this year, and is outside Sadiq Island(aka Greater London). Debden is promised next year, ditto! Buckhurst Hill was simply a case of fitting a couple of card readers by the existing entrances at the southern end of the platforms (western end for us drivers), resurfacing the ramps and fitting handrails which took just four months. The subway that goes under the track is owned by Epping Forest District Council so TfL's spending must have been minimal. As for Debden that presents a few problems so it will be interesting to see what the plans are. I thought Buckhurst Hill was simple, too, but it took contractors about 3 -4 months to do the job just the same, and then they got it wrong, such that anyone in a wheelchair couldn't get down the ramps. I daresay it cost TFL more than one would think.The ramp problem has only just been fixed. The London-end entrances should never have been closed in 1982 in the first place... With Debden, I hope the works won't affect the 1891 lattice-sided footbridge. Loughton is not on the radar yet AFAIK, but very significant works on the listed building would probably be needed. If Epping Forest DC get their way, and build 100 homes on the station car park, then it might just get funded out of s106 money.. |
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londoner
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Post by londoner on Oct 30, 2018 22:58:15 GMT
Having now checked, from the TfL Business Plan for 2010/11 through 2017/18 that was published for review in October 2009, the actual reason cited there is: Why would TfL invest in accessibility of stations that are in close proximity to existing step-free stations in the first place? Large sections of the Central, Metropolitan, Northern and Piccadilly Lines have no step free access. Stations should be selected and prioritised based on factors like: Areas they serve which may have fewer accessible stations. Whether these are Day / Night Tube Termini. Connections they provide to other services. Stations like Rayners Lane, Turnpike Lane, Kentish Town, White City and Leytonstone should be the ones to be prioritised. Granted, these may be less straightforward conversions, but you could argue that providing more step-free stations to areas that have less of them is money better spent. If I understand it correctly, Rayners Lane is a listed building so it will be more difficult to carry out works. There is no obvious way to make Rayners Lane step free, other than potentially adding a ramp from the car park onto the Westbound platform. This however, would mean the current work which is placing some sort of power supplies in the old coal sidings would need to be modified. The station won't be going step free for the foreseeable future. |
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Post by spsmiler on Oct 31, 2018 0:19:08 GMT
I can see how Leytonstone could possibly be made step free but it would represent a significant project.
Put in a bridge over the tracks nearer the eastern end of the platforms where there are no shelters. The ends of this bridge would have lifts and stairs to the bus stops. It would likely means buses would lay over somewhere else. This would not be connected to the existing ticket hall but would increase capacity.
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Post by aslefshrugged on Oct 31, 2018 1:04:47 GMT
I can see how Leytonstone could possibly be made step free but it would represent a significant project. Put in a bridge over the tracks nearer the eastern end of the platforms where there are no shelters. The ends of this bridge would have lifts and stairs to the bus stops. It would likely means buses would lay over somewhere else. This would not be connected to the existing ticket hall but would increase capacity. So basically you'd lose the staff car park on the Grove Green Road side of the station next to the Train Crew Accommodation building, reduce capacity in the car park on the other side of Bus Plaza to accommodate staff parking, lose part of the bus parking area on the Church Lane side, build a new ticket hall, install a complete new gateline and have to double station staff because they'd have to be watching two entrances at once. Where exactly would the 66, 145 and W13 buses lay over? Leytonstone isn't overly blessed with quiet side streets. |
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rincew1nd
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Post by rincew1nd on Oct 31, 2018 1:53:51 GMT
Leytonstone isn't overly blessed with quiet side streets. Are there any quiet side streets in London? |
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Post by patrickb on Oct 31, 2018 4:09:07 GMT
Is it not possible installing three lifts shafts, link them to a subway built under the track? The westbound platform is more than wide enough two thirds of the way up. The eastbound may require a bit of land pinching from the shrubberies behind. The Bus Station/stands could be turned into a proper bus station with a lift shaft in the middle. The work would be disruptive to the tracks above and to other things yes, so you might look at a several months of no weekend service between Liverpool Street - Woodford/Newbury Park and diverted buses.
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Post by aslefshrugged on Oct 31, 2018 10:09:48 GMT
Leytonstone has 11m passenger movements a year, its not like Buckhurst Hill (2.3m) where you can just leave the gates open. If you create a new entrance in the bus station you're going to need a gateline which would have to be staffed so you could implement crowd control if necessary. Also if you build a tunnel under the track you'd need stairs in case the lifts failed while people were in the tunnels, that's an awful lot to fit between the track and Kirkdale Road
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Post by Chris M on Oct 31, 2018 23:23:14 GMT
If you're willing to spend significant amounts of money, you could expand the ticket hall by removing the current stairs to the platforms and tunneling east/north under the tracks. The new access (lift and stairs) to the eastbound platform would be where the grassy area is at the west/southern end of the staff car park (possible loss of 1 maximum car parking space) - additional space could be obtained by rafting over the A12 (simple from an engineering perspective but likely not cheap). Moving the entrance to the middle of the platform would have the added benefit of distributing passengers through the train a bit more.
The eastbound platforms would be trickier. My suggestion is to move whatever is currently using some/all of the rooms on the platform to a new build at the north/east end of the platform canopy and where the current stairs are and build the new access in their place. Alternatively, if those rooms don't need to be at platform level (I have no idea) then they could be provided downstairs with the new tunnelling or by building upwards.
As advertised this would not come cheap, construction would be long, complex and would need to be carefully timed. The station would likely be hell during the construction and some closures would definitely be needed. Locating the construction compound(s) would also need careful thought, and may require rafting (temporarily or permanently) over the A12.
PS: Perhaps a mod might want to rename or split this thread as we're focussing on Leytonstone rather than Amersham (principally my fault).
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londoner
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Post by londoner on Nov 1, 2018 23:43:53 GMT
http://questions.london.gov.uk/QuestionSearch/searchclient/questions/question_301005
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Post by Dstock7080 on Nov 2, 2018 9:47:29 GMT
Newbury Park lifts commissioned yesterday as at 18.00 |
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Post by aslefshrugged on Nov 2, 2018 10:34:34 GMT
Sadly Notting Hill Gate isn't on the list, in 2014 there were plans to redevelop the site that used to be the discount book shop on the north east corner of Notting Hill Gate and Pembridge Gardens (66-74 Notting Hill Gate) with the ground floor as a new entrance to the station with a lift. It seems those plans have been shelved and the site is currently waiting planning permission for redevelopment without the station entrance. A lost opportunity when you consider there aren't many alternative sites near the station where you could create a new entrance.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 2, 2018 12:36:17 GMT
They should start thinking of some solution to provide lifts at inner London deep level stations like St. John's Wood or Swiss Cottage. Or Finchley Road for that matter.
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