Tower Gateway - how much work done so far?

Limehouse will get a second gateline on the c2c end of the interchange bridge. It'd be quite tricky to gate the DLR station, as I think the stairs/lifts deposit you directly onto the street.

I'll try just one more time. The gated entrance/exit leads from the DLR into the street so I cannot see what it has got to do with South Eastern

The two DLR entrances are also equally between Southeastern and the street, because there's easy access between the DLR station and the Southeastern platforms. If the DLR entrances weren't gated, you'd be able to very easily bypass the Southeastern gateline by going through the DLR station. So that's why it had to have gates.

[100andthirty]

I presume southeastern shoud read C2C??

OOPs I thought this related to Tower Gateway, and forgot we somethimes of off-message!

[george1manning]

I see what you mean about being able to use the DLR to bypass the SET gates but as it stands now anybody without a ticket can transfer between DLR and SET and vice versa. I'd have thought gates at the interchange point to protect SET and leaving the DLR open access as per the rest of the system would have been better? As an aside to all of this the 'step free access gate' on SET's London bound platform is usually left open and unattended anyway and a lot of people use it, whether they want step free access or a free ride I couldnt say !

Getting back to Tower Gateway I just though it might be gated being a Central London station and given that on train ticket checks are very rare indeed nowadays.

The two DLR entrances are also equally between Southeastern and the street, because there's easy access between the DLR station and the Southeastern platforms. If the DLR entrances weren't gated, you'd be able to very easily bypass the Southeastern gateline by going through the DLR station. So that's why it had to have gates.[/quote]

[astock5000]

Feb 9, 2009 11:01:54 GMT george1manning said:

I see what you mean about being able to use the DLR to bypass the SET gates but as it stands now anybody without a ticket can transfer between DLR and SET and vice versa. I'd have thought gates at the interchange point to protect SET and leaving the DLR open access as per the rest of the system would have been better?

I agree that the barriers should be between Southeastern and the DLR. I don't see why they don't like putting ticket barriers between two lines, as going through a barrier isn't that much of a problem.

Feb 9, 2009 11:01:54 GMT george1manning said:

Getting back to Tower Gateway I just though it might be gated being a Central London station and given that on train ticket checks are very rare indeed nowadays

There is not much point in putting ticket barriers at Tower Gateway. Tower Gateway doesn't have an interchange to another line, and no other DLR stations (that don't connect with anything) have ticket barriers.

[george1manning]

I just though ticket gates at Tower Gateway would reduce fare evasion which must be somewhat rife on the DLR.

Unless they've been fiddling the numbers, TfL's statistics show the DLR has the lowest rate of fare evasion of any service. Which explains their rampant disinterest in ticket gates.

[george1manning]

Forgive me for asking but how can anybody possibly know how many people are fare dodging when there are no ticket checks? I seem to recall similar claims being made about open boarding bendy buses.

Feb 10, 2009 14:23:51 GMT @cetacean said:

Unless they've been fiddling the numbers, TfL's statistics show the DLR has the lowest rate of fare evasion of any service. Which explains their rampant disinterest in ticket gates.

The figures are estimates based on spot checks.

[george1manning]

Forgive my cynicism but I use the DLR regularly and have never seen any spot checks so I would take these figures with a pinch of salt.

The mathematics of statistical sampling are such that you only have to check a tiny fraction of trains to get a solid grasp of overall levels of fare evasion. Even without understanding the maths, it should be obvious if you check one train and find pretty much everyone has tickets, the chances of encountering something completely different on another train are fairly slim. So you not having personally encountered any kind of check doesn't mean they aren't doing them, or that they aren't doing enough to get accurate figures.

(NB I have no idea what methodology or sample size TfL use)

[Chris M]

I've only ever been an infrequent user of the DLR but I've been checked on several occasions, including between Bow Church and Devons Road on my most recent journey.
More recently than that however I was checked on the H&C somewhere between Paddington and Wood Lane, although I can't remember exactly where.

[Alex F.]

Feb 10, 2009 17:50:51 GMT george1manning said:

Forgive my cynicism but I use the DLR regularly and have never seen any spot checks so I would take these figures with a pinch of salt.

I used DLR regularly (2-3 times a day) for 2.5 years until July 2008, and had at least 2-3 checks every week during that period.

[george1manning]

Two or three checks a week?? I've used the DLR regularly since it opened and whilst the train captains (or whatever they are called) used to do regular ticket checks these seem to have become fewer and fewer in recent years and in any case those without tickets are just asked to get off at the next stop and buy one to avoid a penalty fare.

[astock5000]

Feb 11, 2009 0:55:03 GMT Chris M said:

I've only ever been an infrequent user of the DLR but I've been checked on several occasions, including between Bow Church and Devons Road on my most recent journey.
More recently than that however I was checked on the H&C somewhere between Paddington and Wood Lane, although I can't remember exactly where.

I've had my ticket checked on the DLR and on Tramlink, but not on LU.

Feb 11, 2009 12:09:50 GMT george1manning said:

Two or three checks a week?? I've used the DLR regularly since it opened and whilst the train captains (or whatever they are called) used to do regular ticket checks these seem to have become fewer and fewer in recent years and in any case those without tickets are just asked to get off at the next stop and buy one to avoid a penalty fare.

Train Captains are now called Passenger Service Agents (PSAs). I disagree about ticket checks happening less often now - I don't use the DLR that often and I was checked several times last year.

[Chris M]

Feb 11, 2009 21:50:26 GMT astock5000 said:

I've had my ticket checked on the DLR and on Tramlink, but not on LU.

I've had my ticket checked on almost(?) every Tramlink journey, a fair proprotion of journeys on the DLR and Overground and only a couple of times that I can remember on an LU train. The H&C recently and at the the southern end of the Northern Line on my first journey down that way a few years back (I was checked somewhere between Balham and South Wimbledon). I have a feeling I may have been checked one or two other times as well.

I've only ever been checked once on a bus, and that was on a Debden-bound number 20 on the approach to Loughton.