3-car trains start running in January

[astock5000]

londonreconnections.blogspot.com/2009/11/dlr-3-car-trains-and-footbridges.html

The current plan appears to be for 3-Car units to enter passenger service from Monday 25th January 2010 onwards, with the first services running between Bank and Lewisham on weekdays.

[Deleted]

I arrived at Bank tonight to find the PID showing the next train to be to Canning Town. Odd destination I thought. And then all became clear as a 3 car train pulled in to the platform.

That also answers my question as to what they're going to do with the trains leaving service that normally go to Gallions.

[davidp]

The Wharf Newspaper is reporting here --> www.wharf.co.uk/2010/02/the-wharfs-430pm-travel-update-41.html that the 3-car trains officially start today. HOWEVER, I have been out and about several times so far around Canary Wharf and Mudchute but not spotted one.

[Deleted]

I was in a meeting room over looking the delta junction today and I saw a number of them go past. Not many trains were 3-car. I would estimate that maybe 20% of the Bank-Lewisham ones were (at 11am).

I haven't yet seen any 3-car trains made of old units though. I wonder how soon they will go into service as 3-car...

[Deleted]

The actual date of start of 3-car train operation was yesterday - Monday 22 February with just one train (as noted above).

The officicial launch was today (press notice issued).

[Deleted]

Feb 23, 2010 20:16:46 GMT @jango said:

I haven't yet seen any 3-car trains made of old units though. I wonder how soon they will go into service as 3-car...

I've been wondering about this. I take it there's no reason inhibiting the formation of three-car old trains?

I saw one new three-car train this morning, at last. And at least half a dozen two-car trains, on the Lewisham branch at 9:30-10am. Ho hum...

[Deleted]

Feb 23, 2010 20:16:46 GMT @jango said:

I was in a meeting room over looking the delta junction today and I saw a number of them go past. Not many trains were 3-car. I would estimate that maybe 20% of the Bank-Lewisham ones were (at 11am)

Diana was doing a meeting in one of the Canary Wharf buildings overlooking the junction this morning as well. Jango was that you by the window not paying attention to my presentation?

I just saw one three-car train myself, in the odd glances out. At least it was the first one I have seen. The current fascination for others at the windows is the excavators digging up the silt out of the dock on the site of the Crossrail station (although this work seemed to have stopped today), so our gazing-out moments are not alone.

[Deleted]

i know this might be a bit old now but i spotted one in canary wharf middle platforms a week on saturday ago but it wasn't in service then

[21146]

Saw one formation in the siding at Chrisp Street, another 3-vehicle led by 132 (131 at rear) at West Ferry, and another at Limehouse with 124 at the rear. The were also staff giving the 'right' to NB 3-car trains at Canary Wharf which suggests platform mirrors may be an issue.

[davidp]

Feb 24, 2010 17:23:41 GMT @21146 said:

Saw one formation in the siding at Chrisp Street, another 3-vehicle led by 132 (131 at rear) at West Ferry, and another at Limehouse with 124 at the rear. The were also staff giving the 'right' to NB 3-car trains at Canary Wharf which suggests platform mirrors may be an issue.

I saw 124 coupled with 144 and 135 (I think) at Canary Wharf at about 3pm heading south. There were platform staff in hi-viz vests there and at Herons Quay at least. Any staff sightings at other stations?.

[21146]

Seen on Weds.

www.flickr.com/photos/24772733@N05/4386271232/
www.flickr.com/photos/24772733@N05/4385503711/
www.flickr.com/photos/24772733@N05/4386258254/

[Deleted]

If there are difficulties for the train operator seeing clearances to operate the doors, I wonder if they will be restricted to certain doors only, such as just the centre unit. In which case ticket examination will become a thing of the past, a bad move on a system whose original concept was ungated stations and regular ticket examination on the train. In sngle unit days examination was about 75% f the time, with two it's about 25%, with three units will it be nil ?

[Deleted]

Feb 24, 2010 15:36:43 GMT @diana said:

Feb 23, 2010 20:16:46 GMT @jango said:

I was in a meeting room over looking the delta junction today and I saw a number of them go past. Not many trains were 3-car. I would estimate that maybe 20% of the Bank-Lewisham ones were (at 11am)

Diana was doing a meeting in one of the Canary Wharf buildings overlooking the junction this morning as well. Jango was that you by the window not paying attention to my presentation?

I just saw one three-car train myself, in the odd glances out. At least it was the first one I have seen. The current fascination for others at the windows is the excavators digging up the silt out of the dock on the site of the Crossrail station (although this work seemed to have stopped today), so our gazing-out moments are not alone.

It was pretty boring

Oh, wait, unless you're really a man with long hair, then it probably wasn't your meeting.

In other news, the construction of the Crossrail station is very interesting. I was thinking about doing a time-lapse, but my desk is on the wrong side of the building. Our canteen though is perfectly placed for a good view of the work.

[Deleted]

I got a three-car train home last night. The last car was half-empty - there were several seats free, unheard of usually. The first two cars were significantly busier...

At Cutty Sark SDO locked out the forward and rear two sets of doors (ie. half of each of the leading and trailing vehicles). The CSA had to announce this manually.

[Deleted]

Feb 25, 2010 11:54:02 GMT @creepingbobbism said:

At Cutty Sark SDO locked out the forward and rear two sets of doors (ie. half of each of the leading and trailing vehicles). The CSA had to announce this manually.

This just makes me think of all the foreign (non-Emglish speaking, and thus non-PA comprehending)) tourists the DLR carries, for whom Cutty Sark is probably the number one destination on the system of course, and also who all like to go in the front of the leading vehicle for the view......

[Deleted]

Feb 25, 2010 11:04:05 GMT @jango said:

Oh, wait, unless you're really a man with long hair.

Ummmm ..... the clue is in the name .....

Incidentally, your canteen is not on the 8th floor, is it ?

[Deleted]

Feb 25, 2010 12:13:51 GMT @diana said:

This just makes me think of all the foreign (non-Emglish speaking, and thus non-PA comprehending)) tourists the DLR carries, for whom Cutty Sark is probably the number one destination on the system of course, and also who all like to go in the leading vehicle for the view......

There was one family who wandered up to the third vehicle's third door pair after the CSA had announced, but they quickly realised and exited through the second doors. I did wonder what it'd be like with more passengers in the way...

If memory serves, the visual displays weren't working but all other audio announcements were. This seems to happen a lot on B07 Stock.

[Deleted]

Feb 25, 2010 12:17:24 GMT @diana said:

Feb 25, 2010 11:04:05 GMT @jango said:

Oh, wait, unless you're really a man with long hair.

Ummmm ..... the clue is in the name .....

You never know on t'Internet

Feb 25, 2010 12:17:24 GMT @diana said:

Incidentally, your canteen is not on the 8th floor, is it ?

Nope, it's on the 14th.

There might be one on the 8th as well, but I don't have access to that floor as it's occupied by a different tenant.

[Deleted]

Situation today -

3x3-vehicle trains in service, all B.07/09.

B90/92s not yet ready for 3-vehicle operation apparently.

Saw at first hand the arrangements (selective door opening) at the unlengthened stations at Cutty Sark and Elverson Road which, do, however, have narrow 'catwalks' for use in an emergency. Special posters are at these two stations with a useful (if small) diagram at the bottom of the posters showing which doors won't open.

Note at Cutty Sark at the 3-vehicle stopping mark in the tunnel (both roads), CCTV monitors for the Train Captain (or isn't it Passenger Service Agents today?). CCTV here must be unique to the DLR?

[Deleted]

Feb 26, 2010 18:55:43 GMT @reganorak said:

CCTV here must be unique to the DLR?

CCTV is also in use at Bank for 3 car trains.

[Deleted]

Everyone in the office saying that the new 3-car trains fell at the first hurdle today when the Jubilee was closed in the morning peak. Bank got out of control underground as the passengers were not being carried away fast enough, and apparently the whole station had to be closed, and the Waterloo & City suspended as well.

[Deleted]

diana - I suspect this shows not the failings of the DLR, but really that Canary Wharf is still heavily dependant on a line which transports over 20,000 people in the peaks*.

The DLR is not really a heavy metro like the Jubilee so I don't think it should be able to handle loads that it's not designed for.

On the other hand, if and when Crossrail is finally finished, you'd expect the Jub and Crossrail to complement each other and increase network resilience.



*(basic maths, 24 trains * 500 people per train * 2 directions, rounded down for pessimistic errors)

[Chris M]

I used Bank DLR yesterday late afternoon. Because of the escalator works the only access from Bank (including the W&C) to the DLR is via the Northern Line platforms or via Monument platforms. The Northern Line platforms can get overcrowded in teh peaks just from Northern Line passengers so it does not surprise me that Bank station could not cope with all the Jubilee's passengers as well.
Unless an empty three car train has longer loading time than an empty two-car train or the trains were running at a lower frequency, then I really don't see how the three-car trains did anything more than enable 50% more people to travel per train - helping the situation.

[Deleted]

Mar 2, 2010 12:56:43 GMT Chris M said:

I I really don't see how the three-car trains did anything more than enable 50% more people to travel per train - helping the situation.

We have had to get used to the overloading situation at Bank for far too long now; we must be into year three (or maybe four) of the Jubilee weekend/holiday closures. In passing who decided to shut the Jubilee at weekends AND do grossly disruptive works at Bank on the alternative route at the same time?

But when these crush loads are being carried (I wasn't there today, but by experience of Saturdays before Christmas and similar) it is not the transit down the Northern platforms, or the stairs beyond, that are the limitation, but passengers queued back from the DLR departure platform up the approach passage, and then back up the stairs, which is the pinch point. This is what should be relieved by DLR trains able to carry away 50% more passengers than before, because the biggest holdup was caused by passengers beng unable to board the first train, which is where the justification for the three car scheme came from in the first place.

[Deleted]

...but it was only at that level because of the Jubilee failure?

London Transport infrastructure isn't really designed to cope in failure scenarios. Whether or not it should be is another matter. My own view is that we should be starting to think about 4-tracking bits of new infrastructure and building stations where people can get in trains on one side and leave on the other.

[davidp]

Mar 2, 2010 12:56:43 GMT Chris M said:

Unless an empty three car train has longer loading time than an empty two-car train or the trains were running at a lower frequency, then I really don't see how the three-car trains did anything more than enable 50% more people to travel per train - helping the situation.

Indeed, however I think the issue is that although the DLR are trumpeting the arrival of 3-car trains on the Bank to Lewisham route, no-one seems to have seen more than 3 (out of a peak requirement of 15) trains formed of 3-cars out at any one time - and I make that 33 cars in total, up from 30 prior to the upgrade or only an 10% additional capacity - so far.

[norbitonflyer]

Fortunately I wasn't there today, but I heard all the woes on the traffic news in the car (well, London, Surrey and Essex - Radio Kent reported the tube was running normally!)

Why did the W&C have to shut? The main entrance (the Travolator) is quite separate from the rest of the complex and I assume the link to the Central/Northern link tunnels can be closed off.

[Deleted]

Having used the DLR regulaly for a period of 18 months to get to work, all be-it prior to the beginning of 3-car operation, my opinion is that the addition of the 3rd car was not to aid situations where the Jub was closed, but to alleviate crush level on the DLR under normal working conditions. On numerous days I was forced to wait for 3 or 4 trains to Bank before being able to board. So bad was the morning peak I was left with two options were I to arrive at work in a punctual manner. These were:

1) leave 20 mins earlier and use DLR
2) leave 20 mins earlier and take the C2C train from Limehouse to Fenchurch St, then walk to Tower Hill and take the District/Circle to Cannon Street, then catch a 344 bus or walk for 20 mins. Blackfrairs would have been a better station for me, but is currently closed.

Normally, I opted for the latter as even though there were more variables, I had a better chance of arriving on time.

Hence I can only suggest that 3-car operation was designed to make trips into Bank for regular DLR users a more comfortable experience.

[Deleted]

I saw my first three-car train of old (ie. B90/B92/B2K) stock this morning.

On board there was a DVA announcement about alighting at Cutty Sark (and, presumably, Deptford Bridge), which is also a new development. Is this system a computerised text-to-speech one, rather than one of pre-recorded clips? The new message sounded identical in style to the existing announcements.

[astock5000]

3-car trains are now running on the Bank - Woolwich Arsenal service:

www.britishtramsonline.co.uk/news.html

The first three car trains operating to Woolwich Arsenal have now been noted with our correspondent seeing two so formed sets on Monday 21st June – one being lead by 101 and the other by 104.