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Post by Dstock7080 on Jul 4, 2010 13:54:12 GMT
Emergency Timetable for tomorrow, Monday.
At least an Ealing-High Street service will run at the West end.
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Post by 21146 on Jul 4, 2010 15:34:32 GMT
In this weather?!! ;D ;D I see on the T fL website that the suspension is now Whitechapel to Hornchurch, which implies there is an Upminster to Hornchurch shuttle operating (I'll find out when I book on at 1600). This is exactly what I mean; what is the point of that? Upminster Bridge is probably the quietest station on the line and Hornchurch is only ever sort of busy during the weekday peaks - and it's nowhere near the town centre. This is running a silly shuttle for the sake of it rather a useful service. Running this short rail shuttle allowed the emergency buses to be concentrated over a smaller area, increasing frequency |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 4, 2010 15:37:23 GMT
I did hear that a certain manager was pushing for a service to be offered today (well, Yesterday now) even though it was blindingly obvious that it just wasn't possible. IMO people like that don't help. I heard nothing of the sort and I was at work yesterday. I think if there had been any serious suggestion to do this I would have heard something about it. Given stalled trains were being moved all afternoon I don't think anyone with a braincell would have considered this a realistic possibility. I see on the T fL website that the suspension is now Whitechapel to Hornchurch, which implies there is an Upminster to Hornchurch shuttle operating (I'll find out when I book on at 1600). This is exactly what I mean; what is the point of that? Upminster Bridge is probably the quietest station on the line and Hornchurch is only ever sort of busy during the weekday peaks - and it's nowhere near the town centre. This is running a silly shuttle for the sake of it rather a useful service. Running a shuttle gives passengers from Hornchurch and Upminster Bridge a link to the C2C at Upminster. Of course it would be better to run Dagenham East but if Hornchurch was all that was available I still say it's better than nothing. |
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North End
Beneath Newington Causeway
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Post by North End on Jul 4, 2010 15:53:54 GMT
In this weather?!! ;D ;D I see on the T fL website that the suspension is now Whitechapel to Hornchurch, which implies there is an Upminster to Hornchurch shuttle operating (I'll find out when I book on at 1600). This is exactly what I mean; what is the point of that? Upminster Bridge is probably the quietest station on the line and Hornchurch is only ever sort of busy during the weekday peaks - and it's nowhere near the town centre. This is running a silly shuttle for the sake of it rather a useful service. If you happened to turn up at Hornchurch expecting to travel, would you be satisfied to be told "we could have run some sort of service, but we couldn't be bothered". If a train and operator is available, something should be provided, even if it isn't the normal service. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 4, 2010 17:51:53 GMT
East end now running Upminster to Dagenham East.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 4, 2010 19:34:13 GMT
Latest extract from TfL Press Notice this evening -
· No Underground service between Plaistow and Dagenham East
· Reduced service on District and Hammersmith & City lines
· Full services expected to resume from Wednesday
"LU's engineers have been working around the clock over the weekend to restore services as quickly as possible and have been able to reinstate a reduced service between Whitechapel and Plaistow and Upminster and Dagenham East on the District line. A bus replacement service is operating between Plaistow and Dagenham East. However, all services on the District Line are affected and are operating at a reduced capacity. Services on the Circle line are also currently affected and are operating without the branch between Hammersmith and Edgware Road".
So, a proper Circle Line once again!!
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Post by Deleted on Jul 4, 2010 19:55:33 GMT
Planned service for tomorrow: 1 Olympia shuttle; 12 min service High St - Ealing Bwy; 10 min service Wimbledon - Plaistow; 10 min service Richmond - Plaistow; 10 min service Wimbledon - Edgware Rd; 10 min service Dagenham East - Upminster
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Post by jamesb on Jul 4, 2010 21:38:17 GMT
You wouldn't want a cable fire of those proportions happening in a tunnel would you?
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Post by 21146 on Jul 4, 2010 22:15:56 GMT
You wouldn't want a cable fire of those proportions happening in a tunnel would you? Hopefully tunnels don't have that much overgrown, dried-out, foilage waiting for a stray spark on a hot day. Maybe the LT Vegetation Control Dept needs to be recreated? |
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mrfs42
71E25683904T 172E6538094T
Big Hair Day
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Post by mrfs42 on Jul 4, 2010 22:25:41 GMT
Planned service for tomorrow: 1 Olympia shuttle; 12 min service High St - Ealing Bwy; 10 min service Wimbledon - Plaistow; 10 min service Richmond - Plaistow; 10 min service Wimbledon - Edgware Rd; 10 min service Dagenham East - Upminster Oh. So *that* set of PM rolls is still kicking around.  Flippancy aside that would actually pan out into a fairly stable pattern without much in the way of stand time - the odd Wimbo - Plaistow might be curtailed (and then the next-but-one from the opposite branch) likewise to get everything back square. However that's only a random bit of thinking and will probably bear no basis in reality. If there's the stock to run that density of service in the right sort of places, then somebody, somewhere has made a very sensible decision. |
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Colin
Advisor
My preserved fire engine!
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Post by Colin on Jul 5, 2010 0:58:38 GMT
Running this short rail shuttle allowed the emergency buses to be concentrated over a smaller area, increasing frequency Granted. However by the very nature of being an emergency replacement, the buses could have operated over the smaller area regardless - there is plenty of spare capacity on local service buses on a Sunday, with the 248 & 370 serving both Upminster & Upminster Bridge. Those two routes also link with the 165 & 372 (for Elm Park), 252 (for Hornchurch & Elm Park) and 256 (for Hornchurch) at Hornchurch town centre; they can also provide links to Dagenham East and beyond via Romford. I heard nothing of the sort and I was at work yesterday. I think if there had been any serious suggestion to do this I would have heard something about it. Given stalled trains were being moved all afternoon I don't think anyone with a braincell would have considered this a realistic possibility. The line's performance manager trains was at Upminster and was making the suggestion. Running a shuttle gives passengers from Hornchurch and Upminster Bridge a link to the C2C at Upminster. Of course it would be better to run Dagenham East but if Hornchurch was all that was available I still say it's better than nothing. As said above, there is plenty of capacity available on local bus services at the weekends. Obviously weekdays are a different beast and we'll have to see how that goes. If you happened to turn up at Hornchurch expecting to travel, would you be satisfied to be told "we could have run some sort of service, but we couldn't be bothered". If a train and operator is available, something should be provided, even if it isn't the normal service. You wouldn't be told that unless staff were looking to create a conflict situation, so let's be adult about it. Whilst I agree we should attempt to provide a service if it's possible, I would question whether we should even it's totally pointless. We were carrying an average of 6 passengers west from Upminster and just 1, sometimes 2, back east. On a six car D stock, per trip. Almost all of those 6 going west were heading beyond Hornchurch, so the service we ran wasn't actually benefiting the users. Given the local bus route options from Upminster, we were probably the worst of the choices open to those travelling. East end now running Upminster to Dagenham East. Now we're talking - a service that's much more useful, particularly to those travelling via Upminster & c2c. Only trouble is local service buses from Dagenham East are not so good, so come Monday morning we'll have to hope Upminster & c2c can cope. Planned service for tomorrow: 1 Olympia shuttle; 12 min service High St - Ealing Bwy; 10 min service Wimbledon - Plaistow; 10 min service Richmond - Plaistow; 10 min service Wimbledon - Edgware Rd; 10 min service Dagenham East - Upminster That isn't a whole lot different from normal frequencies [on the branches], though of course there'll be less capacity through the central area (by virtue of less trains available) and of course a 5 minute frequency is the norm into Upminster. The west end of the line should be ok, but the east end is gonna be an issue. The replacement bus service will struggle to cope with road traffic let alone passenger numbers, and c2c is generally already over capacity in the peaks as it is. I'm glad I'm on lates this week as I suspect that'll be the easier of the two peak periods. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 5, 2010 1:18:31 GMT
Planned service for tomorrow: 1 Olympia shuttle; 12 min service High St - Ealing Bwy; 10 min service Wimbledon - Plaistow; 10 min service Richmond - Plaistow; 10 min service Wimbledon - Edgware Rd; 10 min service Dagenham East - Upminster Oh. So *that* set of PM rolls is still kicking around. I doubt very much that that featured in their plans. The way the district line often work is to keep everything running and then blame the signalmen when the trains start to block back and wrong signals occur due to increased workload. |
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Post by citysig on Jul 5, 2010 8:18:50 GMT
So, a proper Circle Line once again!! Yes, bit of a cop-out in my opinion. We're running the engineering timetable of the weekend of 26th/27th June. I think we could have done a little more given we had the weekend to think about it - but then I wasn't there to push anything. Available trains on our end of the line was mooted, but again... |
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cso
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Post by cso on Jul 5, 2010 9:03:11 GMT
There seems to be a collection of trains in Wembley Park sidings that seem to have had a new paint job, I'm assuming that was the C/D stock that was attacked on Friday night?
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Post by bicbasher on Jul 5, 2010 11:00:28 GMT
On my journey to Royal Oak this morning, the Circle behind the H&C was given priority and went into platform 3 (District) at Edgware Road.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 5, 2010 13:32:26 GMT
There seems to be a collection of trains in Wembley Park sidings that seem to have had a new paint job, I'm assuming that was the C/D stock that was attacked on Friday night? Yes 5 c-stock trains only the outside (nearest running lines) had been attacked from what i could see |
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Post by plasmid on Jul 5, 2010 14:07:03 GMT
I hate graffiti, wasn't new fencing erected from Bromley-By-Bow all the way up to and beyond East Ham on the C2C side of the track?
I can see parts though where fencing is incomplete and possible access points near bridges where the fencing is whack. Another point is that bridge between West Ham and Bromley-By-Bow, they tag that bridge the day after it gets painted, pretty sure they climb up from the path below which runs with the river.
Any clues yet as to how the fire had started?
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Post by citysig on Jul 5, 2010 14:09:52 GMT
On my journey to Royal Oak this morning, the Circle behind the H&C was given priority and went into platform 3 (District) at Edgware Road. Not necessarily "priority." The H&C may have been early and the Circle may have been spot on time. With the reduced timetable in operation, only 1 middle platform is required for reversing trains (Districts only). |
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Post by citysig on Jul 5, 2010 14:16:02 GMT
Yes 6 c-stock trains only the outside (nearest running lines) had been attacked from what i could see 6? Excellent, if as a result of the fire we've also laid an extra siding at Wembley ;D Question is, can we fit an S-8 on it ;D |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 5, 2010 14:42:40 GMT
Yes 6 c-stock trains only the outside (nearest running lines) had been attacked from what i could see 6? Excellent, if as a result of the fire we've also laid an extra siding at Wembley ;D Question is, can we fit an S-8 on it ;D yes sorry i mean't 5 but there was also another one in neasden depot |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 5, 2010 16:41:27 GMT
There was a cable fire at Barking in June 2001 although if I remember correctly it only the Hammersmith and City line was suspended between Whitechapel and Barking. Not the same cable this time is it?
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Post by bicbasher on Jul 5, 2010 16:46:14 GMT
On my journey to Royal Oak this morning, the Circle behind the H&C was given priority and went into platform 3 (District) at Edgware Road. Not necessarily "priority." The H&C may have been early and the Circle may have been spot on time. With the reduced timetable in operation, only 1 middle platform is required for reversing trains (Districts only). The H&C was sandwiched between two Circles. The 2nd Circle was behind my train which had plenty of space due to the first one arriving 5 mins before. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 5, 2010 17:52:30 GMT
Planned service for tomorrow: 1 Olympia shuttle; 12 min service High St - Ealing Bwy; 10 min service Wimbledon - Plaistow; 10 min service Richmond - Plaistow; 10 min service Wimbledon - Edgware Rd; 10 min service Dagenham East - Upminster Thank you for the information. I wanted to get from Ealing Broadway to Sloane Square as normal this morning peak. Waited forjust over twenty minutes at Ealing for a train to arrive and leave, whilst hearing those good service anoisements. Then had to change at Earls Court. Hardly a good service when your journey takes over twice as long. |
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Post by citysig on Jul 5, 2010 18:24:58 GMT
The H&C was sandwiched between two Circles. The 2nd Circle was behind my train which had plenty of space due to the first one arriving 5 mins before. H&Cs are generally sandwiched between Circles, and vice versa, to give the H&C>Circle>H&C>Circle service at Edgware Road. What I think you're saying is that your H&C had, to begin with, 2 Circles behind it, of which one was passed around your train at Edgware Road. So more than likely the first was running around 5 late (going on your timings) which isn't bad considering there are probably fairly heavy loadings on the service we're operating. |
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Post by norbitonflyer on Jul 5, 2010 19:09:15 GMT
According to the BBC website "Services to Barking and Dagenham East have been suspended on the District, Hammersmith and City and Circle lines"
I wondered why I hadn't seen any Circle line trains at Barking today!
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Post by bicbasher on Jul 5, 2010 19:53:59 GMT
The H&C was sandwiched between two Circles. The 2nd Circle was behind my train which had plenty of space due to the first one arriving 5 mins before. H&Cs are generally sandwiched between Circles, and vice versa, to give the H&C>Circle>H&C>Circle service at Edgware Road. What I think you're saying is that your H&C had, to begin with, 2 Circles behind it, of which one was passed around your train at Edgware Road. So more than likely the first was running around 5 late (going on your timings) which isn't bad considering there are probably fairly heavy loadings on the service we're operating. I was at Baker Street initially on the westbound Circ/H&C platform. It went, Circle, then two Met's from Aldgate, H&C which I boarded, then the next Circle which was right behind. |
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cso
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Post by cso on Jul 5, 2010 21:02:20 GMT
Quick picture of some of the grafiti'd trains... taken from a blackberry as I shot past on a Jubilee Line this evening.
Pic removed by staff. As you see from our rules, we don't allow pics of graffitied trains since it only encourages others.
Be interested to know what the plan is, in terms of cleaning them... get them back in to service and clean when the service is suspended at the weekends?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 5, 2010 21:16:45 GMT
Colin!
regarding the Upminster - Hornchurch shuttle and your suggestion it shouldn't be run, I have to respectfully suggest you are talking absolute nonsence!
Certainly if it is possible to run the service it should be run. I'd totally refute your comments about it's usefulness.
Since I live in Hornchurch, nearish to the station and not near the town centre, i consider I am well placed to comment upon the difficulties!
Many Hornchurch residents take the choice to travel to Upminster in order to travel into London by C2C anyway and why should they be deprived this service or it's option as an alternative? Likewise the reverse journey. During pm peaks you get as many passengers travelling Upminster to Hornchurch as arrive at Hornchurch direct from the city.
I fail to see why Elm Park and Dagenham East should be so much more deserving of a service? In terms of access to the Upminster/Barking/West Ham/Tower corridor, both Elm Park and Dagenham East at least have direct one bus links to C2C (165 or 372 Elm Park to Rainham) and (103 Dagenham East to Rainham). Whilst the three bus routes from Hornchurch 193, 252 and 256 do not access anywhere on the C2C corridor. There may be capacity on the Hornchurch routes on a sunday, but most of them only run every 20 mins and will require at least two different buses.
Of course in general terms a Dagenham East - Upminster shuttle is better than just a Hornchurch - Upminster one because it provides more connection opportunities.
Since I had to use the buses twice on Saturday (256 and 248 outbound) and fortunately a dedicated Rail Replacement bus back on Sat night. I would have welcomed a service train at that point!
One has to wonder if a few more passengers may have been present if announcements were a touch more consistent about whether the service was suspended to Upminster or Hornchurch!!
Even LUL/TfL, who now do NOT operate rail replacement buses where it is considered local buses provide adequate replacement, with some fairly questionable decisions, accept that replacement buses have to be provided along the Upminster - Barking route!
In fact there have a been a few occassions with general "short term" service suspensions due to failures Eastbound at Dagenham and such like, when I have been working, when i have demanded to know why a perfectly functional Upminster - Hornchurch does not have a shuttle service, which I also offer to drive, has been responded by the Duty Manager "we should do, but the service controller allowed/wanted* all the trains to go west and left us nothing to run it with" even when announcements have been made that the suspension is Barking - Hornchurch ....not running a service when you can/should makes fools of us all!
Anyway rant aside, there are 3 C stock trains stabled in Upminster depot.
* = delete as applicable
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Post by Deleted on Jul 5, 2010 23:46:36 GMT
Just to give a few more details on the service that ran on Monday 5th:
Trains 001 - 004: Dagenham East - Upminster
Trains 070 - 077: Wimbledon - Edgware Road (normal timetable)
Trains 101 - 104: Ealing Broadway - High St Kensington
Train 151: Olympia - High St Kensington
Trains 401 - 4??: Wimbledon - Plaistow
Trains 501 - 5??: Richmond - Plaistw
And the unusual one:
Train 601: Northfields Depot empty to Acton Town, then in service to Plaistow, then empty to Upminster Depot.
I had to take this out of Northfields Depot with a pilot and ran it as far as Earls Court. Hopefully it made it to Upminster!
I hit a few low hanging tree branches and bushes running on the eastbound local between Northfields and Acton Town; could see the scratches on the roof!
There were 3 other D stocks in Northfields depot, which I believe had been there since Friday night.
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Post by Dstock7080 on Jul 6, 2010 0:41:23 GMT
Services started-up as a normal Monday from ECom with just a couple cancelled, usual numbers etc.
Trains were reformed into the special numbers/services around 0700.
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