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Post by norbitonflyer on Sept 9, 2021 6:46:29 GMT
Opening ceremonies do not have to coincide with first trains, there can be days or even weeks between them. Quite, but the press release refers to the first train, not an opening ceremony. There may be other reasons for not starting the public service at 05:28.
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Post by t697 on Sept 9, 2021 14:59:03 GMT
New line diagrams are now appearing in the trains. As well as showing the NLE, Out of Station Interchanges (OSI) have bee added at Archway and Camden for London Overground and South Wimbledon for Trams. Oops, perhaps I shouldn't have mentioned the 'T' word.
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Post by MoreToJack on Sept 9, 2021 22:38:02 GMT
Euston Square at Euston has also been added as an OSI - I think this is the first time that the ‘stack’ of lines has been split in this way.
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jimbo
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Post by jimbo on Sept 10, 2021 0:51:30 GMT
I hope someone is going to send us a pic for us all to see!
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Post by goldenarrow on Sept 10, 2021 11:01:15 GMT
I hope someone is going to send us a pic for us all to see! Mr Marshall has afforded us the privilege: Click here if tweet fails to appear
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Post by sd826e on Sept 10, 2021 13:15:40 GMT
No OSI for Battersea Park and Queenstown Road despite both being within walking distance! Shame. Still no OSI shown for Warren Street several years later. Battersea Power Station Pier truncated to Battersea Pier. It now looks like all trains via Charing Cross travel to/from Battersea Power Station. A journey from Elephant & Castle to Oval looks like the cost of both zones 1 & 2 rather than just zone 2. Still no 'Trains to Luton' at London Bridge 25 years later.
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Post by bomo on Sept 10, 2021 13:36:43 GMT
It now looks like all trains via Charing Cross travel to/from Battersea Power Station.
No it doesn't. There are plenty of stations short of the end of the line where trains regularly terminate and no specific indication of that is shown on the in-train line diagrams.
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class411
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Post by class411 on Sept 10, 2021 14:08:04 GMT
Still no OSI shown for Warren Street a dozen years later. Warren Street to where? And a dozen years after what?
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Post by 35b on Sept 10, 2021 14:33:55 GMT
Still no OSI shown for Warren Street a dozen years later. Warren Street to where? And a dozen years after what? Presumably Euston Square - Google suggests that they're a massive 3 minutes' walk apart.
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class411
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Post by class411 on Sept 10, 2021 15:57:10 GMT
Warren Street to where? And a dozen years after what? Presumably Euston Square - Google suggests that they're a massive 3 minutes' walk apart. Well, yes, and Great Portland Street is not much farther. It's the 'twelve years later' that's confusing, as all those stations have been there for well over twelve years. Or was there some change in what LU consider OOI stations, twelve years ago? (Sorry drifting off topic, here)
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Post by goldenarrow on Sept 10, 2021 16:11:41 GMT
Presumably Euston Square - Google suggests that they're a massive 3 minutes' walk apart. Or was there some change in what LU consider OOI stations, twelve years ago? Warren Street - Euston Square OSI in 2017 after several years of people suggesting it. OSI's in this area is a tough one to show because Euston Square is well known for its close proximity to Euston even though Warren Street does afford a better interchange between the Northern and SSR. I do think there needs to be better uniformity about how OSI's are shown on line diagrams because the consistency is all over the place. The changes being made for the Northern Line Extension illustrate this perfectly.
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jimbo
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Post by jimbo on Sept 10, 2021 19:36:26 GMT
Euston Square at Euston has also been added as an OSI - I think this is the first time that the ‘stack’ of lines has been split in this way. A pic of this also would help understand how it now appears.
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Post by Chris L on Sept 10, 2021 20:23:41 GMT
Or was there some change in what LU consider OOI stations, twelve years ago? Warren Street - Euston Square OSI in 2017 after several years of people suggesting it. OSI's in this area is a tough one to show because Euston Square is well known for its close proximity to Euston even though Warren Street does afford a better interchange between the Northern and SSR. I do think there needs to be better uniformity about how OSI's are shown on line diagrams because the consistency is all over the place. The changes being made for the Northern Line Extension illustrate this perfectly. It wasn't easy back in the day when Euston Square was shown the wrong side of Euston on the Tube map.
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Post by goldenarrow on Sept 12, 2021 12:15:20 GMT
Euston Square at Euston has also been added as an OSI - I think this is the first time that the ‘stack’ of lines has been split in this way. A pic of this also would help understand how it now appears. Photo below. Platform line diagrams also show Euston Square OSI 'floating' like this. 1995 Tube Stock car line diagram by bowroaduk, on Flickr
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Post by Alight on Sept 13, 2021 16:51:48 GMT
It now looks like all trains via Charing Cross travel to/from Battersea Power Station. No it doesn't. There are plenty of stations short of the end of the line where trains regularly terminate and no specific indication of that is shown on the in-train line diagrams.
Apologies if this has been asked already, but I thought the plan was to do away with the through trains to Morden from Kennington via CX once the Battersea branch opened? I thought the proposed frequency was for there to be a train to Battersea every 10 minutes (initially) and then run the rest of them via the Kennington loop?
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Post by t697 on Sept 13, 2021 22:16:44 GMT
No it doesn't. There are plenty of stations short of the end of the line where trains regularly terminate and no specific indication of that is shown on the in-train line diagrams.
Apologies if this has been asked already, but I thought the plan was to do away with the through trains to Morden from Kennington via CX once the Battersea branch opened? I thought the proposed frequency was for there to be a train to Battersea every 10 minutes (initially) and then run the rest of them via the Kennington loop? Yes. Some to Battersea and some round the loop. And the line diagram shows a peaks only through running Morden branch to/from CX branch.
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Post by ducatisti on Sept 14, 2021 10:20:32 GMT
Will there be direct trains from High Barnet branch to Battersea?
If they are direct and predictable, this becomes a possible commute for me, rather than taking the train and changing.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2021 10:38:07 GMT
At certain times of the day there will be, but they will need weeding out from the working timetable when it is published on the internet.
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Post by Dstock7080 on Sept 14, 2021 10:57:34 GMT
Will there be direct trains from High Barnet branch to Battersea? If they are direct and predictable, this becomes a possible commute for me, rather than taking the train and changing. M-F 06.02 06.10 07.11 07.51 09.09 09.34 09.45 09.57 [10.09 10.33 10.45 10.57 ] same times each hour until: 15.33 15.57 16.14 16.23 18.50 19.34 19.45 19.57 [20.09 20.33 20.45 20.57 ] same times each hour until: 23.18 23.45 23.54.
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Post by ducatisti on Sept 14, 2021 12:48:55 GMT
Thanks D-stock. A whacking great gap at the useful times. Oh well...
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Post by Dstock7080 on Sept 16, 2021 14:30:02 GMT
extract from new Tube Map:
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Post by Dstock7080 on Sept 16, 2021 14:36:59 GMT
The press release linked to above says "TfL will confirm the time of the first train to serve Nine Elms and Battersea Power Station on Monday 20 September in due course". Which suggests an official opening ceremony at an hour more amenable to the bigwigs. (After all, how would they get there for 0528?) Railway press offices have learned the lesson of the APT's (Advanced Passenger Train) inaugural run in 1981, which required journalists to be at Glasgow Central on a cold December morning an hour and a half before dawn. This was not calculated to endear the project to the reporters. (It's also possible that the motion sickness reported by several of the hacks was exacerbated by the lack of sleep, hurried (or no) breakfast after too much Scotch "hospitality" the night before, and the inability to see the horizon until well into the journey). Announcement today: New Tube map unveiled featuring new Northern line stations to open next week as Tube extends to Battersea Power Station
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Post by mcmaddog on Sept 16, 2021 19:51:24 GMT
extract from new Tube Map: That makes it look like an off-puttingly long walk between the Charing Cross and Bank branches at Kennington
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jimbo
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Post by jimbo on Sept 16, 2021 19:52:01 GMT
extract from new Tube Map: Well, looking at the new map, there will be no way for Morden trains to run through to Charing Cross branch, and even the Kennington interchange will be a long walk between branches! And I thought Kennington station was to be unchanged except for a few new passages. ;-)
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rincew1nd
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Post by rincew1nd on Sept 16, 2021 19:57:24 GMT
extract from new Tube Map: The radius of the curve seems greater than normal.
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Post by Alight on Sept 16, 2021 20:20:48 GMT
Agreed, at an initial glance I instantly wondered whether or not they've broken any Beck rules... I'm guessing not if they went ahead and published it. That being said, I rather like its appearance - a lot 'sexier' than some of the previous mock ups of the Battersea branch awkwardly spurring off at a sharp right angle. extract from new Tube Map: Well, looking at the new map, there will be no way for Morden trains to run through to Charing Cross branch, and even the Kennington interchange will be a long walk between branches! And I thought Kennington station was to be unchanged except for a few new passages. ;-) Yet, the line diagrams still refer to through services to Morden during the peak... not that I think this should be a thing, as most regular users are used to changing at Kennington, so I don't see what good a few through trains every now and then will do... surely the benefit cannot outweigh inevitable confusion to tourists and the like as they try to get their head around the complexity of the Northern line?!
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Post by Chris M on Sept 16, 2021 21:16:34 GMT
The radius of the curve seems greater than normal. Yes and no - on the May tube map there are three different curve radii: The black line is the new curve at Battersea Power Station, which is the same radius as the new one between Kennington and Nine Elms - and also to the curve of TfL Rail west of Hayes & Harlington onto the Heathrow branch* The blue line is the Piccadilly line west of Heathrow Terminal 4*, which is the same radius as the Northern line curve between Old Street and Angel*. The red line is the Central line between Chigwell and Grange Hill*, which is the same radius as the Victoria line between King's Cross and Highbury & Islington* and London Overground between Queen's Park and Kilburn High Road*. *Taken from the May 2021 tube map imported from the pdf at 235 pixels/inch, which makes the line widths nearly identical to on the snippet above.
Edit: Where the three SSR lines run adjacent one line seems to take a standard radius curve and the others are fit to that curve. Between Tower Hill and Aldgate, the District line uses the same radius as the Piccadilly line Heathrow T4 curve and the circle line fits within that. Between Liverpool Street and Aldgate, the Metropolitan line takes the sharpest of the three radii above, the Circle fits outside that and the H&C fits outside the Circle for a short while until branching off.
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slugabed
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Post by slugabed on Sept 16, 2021 23:13:23 GMT
"Yet, the line diagrams still refer to through services to Morden during the peak... not that I think this should be a thing, as most regular users are used to changing at Kennington, so I don't see what good a few through trains every now and then will do... surely the benefit cannot outweigh inevitable confusion to tourists and the like as they try to get their head around the complexity of the Northern line?!"
Wasn't the reason for these trains given as balancing between depots?
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Post by Alight on Sept 16, 2021 23:38:14 GMT
You're probably right. Also, maybe through services will come in handy next year during the temporary closure of most of the Bank branch.
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Post by brigham on Sept 17, 2021 7:36:23 GMT
You're probably right. Also, maybe through services will come in handy next year during the temporary closure of most of the Bank branch. I wonder why this option hasn't been 'rationalised' out?
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