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Post by panniertank on Jul 4, 2011 14:25:36 GMT
This is the number openly being quoted around the company, Well i hope so, with well over 30 already built, and both Derby and Ashforby overflowing with them, they sooner they arrive the better.
Also we are very close to, one in and one out with the met. one s delivered, one a taken away at the same time.
times they are a changing..
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metman
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Post by metman on Jul 4, 2011 14:43:16 GMT
Leaving by rail or still road?
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Post by malcolmffc on Jul 4, 2011 15:04:19 GMT
Good to hear! The rate of S Stock introduction and A stock withdrawal has been very disappointing in recent months.
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cso
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Post by cso on Jul 4, 2011 15:09:35 GMT
So the plan is about one every week and a half? (9 apparently here, 17 to make 26 - 25 weeks to go until Christmas at a rough count)
I thought there was more work to be completed at Neasden before more were arriving?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 4, 2011 21:35:57 GMT
From recent travels, there's still plenty of building works going on at Neasden Depo...
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Post by Deleted on Jul 4, 2011 21:40:04 GMT
Bad news, if this does happen
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Post by Deleted on Jul 4, 2011 21:52:06 GMT
Bad news, if this does happen No Onion, good news. Everything dies and it's good that there's something to replace it. Nature abhors a vacuum. Think positive and it'll all be alright.  |
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Post by citysig on Jul 4, 2011 23:11:31 GMT
This is the number openly being quoted around the company, Well i hope so, with well over 30 already built, and both Derby and Ashforby overflowing with them, they sooner they arrive the better. Also we are very close to, one in and one out with the met. one s delivered, one a taken away at the same time. times they are a changing.. We've got technically 6 running already, and I know for a fact we'll have 10 by the start (or immediately just after the start) of the new timetable on 31st July. 26 or more is therefore not beyond the realms of possibility. There was someone on here a few months back, who seemed to take pictures in the same locations within Neasden Depot as the recent A-stock ones, who was a big critic of the S-stock. Nice to see some support growing for it now... |
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Post by astock5000 on Jul 4, 2011 23:25:47 GMT
Good to hear! The rate of S Stock introduction and A stock withdrawal has been very disappointing in recent months. It's been very slow, but I wouldn't say it is disappointing. So the plan is about one every week and a half? (9 apparently here, 17 to make 26 - 25 weeks to go until Christmas at a rough count) That is about the same delivery rate as the 2009TS recently so it makes sense, but that means the Met won't have 40 S8s until about early May next year - there was a rumour that S7s would be delivered after the first 40 S8s. As it now seems that the first S7 could enter service at the end of the year, will there be a gap in S8 deliveries after maybe the first 30, or will a mixture of S7s and S8s be delivered for a while? with well over 30 already built, and both Derby and Ashforby overflowing with them If there's (only) 26 in service by christmas, unless production is slowed down Derby and Ashforby will still be 'overflowing'. |
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prjb
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Post by prjb on Jul 6, 2011 22:08:13 GMT
Trains for disposal will continue to leave by road for now, but rail removal is very much on the cards for the future.
The rate of introduction has been steady and cautious, which is how we have planned it. Recent deliveries have been hampered by circumstances out of our control but should resume soon. We need another test train for S7 which will also take up an S8 delivery path but thats not the end of the world.
There will not be a break in S8 deliveries for S7's, and we should be seeing an increase in S8 deliveries very soon (at a rate of one per week).
Apologies for the lack of posts recently, it's been a bit busy as you can imagine!
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metman
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Post by metman on Jul 7, 2011 21:02:56 GMT
So the A stock will be gone within the year then? No S7s for the 2012 games then?  |
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Post by citysig on Jul 7, 2011 21:51:39 GMT
So the A stock will be gone within the year then? No S7s for the 2012 games then? This is contrary to what I was told the other evening by a man very much in charge of the H&C. However, as prjb is on the project, he would know if there has been a policy change. The deliveries have been let down by the (ironically I suppose) 50-odd year old Class 20s that deliver the stock. The H&C WTT27 is being written with the sole objective of getting the S7s tested and on the road for the Olympics - self-contained test paths, additional run as required trips, and the infrastructure will be better prepared than the Met was. Plus more space and better handling of crowds. It was always felt that a few of both S8s and S7s would be better than all S8s and all C-stocks. |
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Post by mcmaddog on Jul 7, 2011 22:04:20 GMT
Perhaps what prjb is implying is that S8 will continue unabated but with extra S7 deliveries. He doesn't say there won't be S7s just no breaks in S8s.
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metman
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Post by metman on Jul 7, 2011 22:05:45 GMT
Well I have to agree. The extra car and space will be most useful come 2012. The S8s would run to main city serivce with remaining A stock on other duties if possible.
We shall see.....
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Post by citysig on Jul 7, 2011 23:24:28 GMT
...with remaining A stock on other duties if possible. We shall see..... I do sort of feel for you and the A-stock, but given the December 2011 timetable changes (all trains inter-mingled with each other and no self-containment, except on the Amershams which will be city trains) and the fact that the Olympic Timetable will probably mirror this, what "other duties" will the A-stock be covering. It would be "nice" if there was some sort of branch line service that they could cover and be kept out of the way on. However, despite what opinions some may have of the S-stock today, come less than a year from now I can already hear station staff saying "Oh no, the next one in is one of those old trains, that will never shift these customers. At least the 2 behind are S-stocks." Sad but true when it comes to packing them in. |
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metman
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Post by metman on Jul 8, 2011 12:52:42 GMT
Definately. But the december timetable may not last, at least I hope not, it's pants!
Now with the current timetable, A stock could be used on the Amersham service and not go into the city!
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2011 13:05:26 GMT
Definately. But the december timetable may not last, at least I hope not, it's pants! Now with the current timetable, A stock could be used on the Amersham service and not go into the city! In what way is the December timetable pants? Tad early to comment, it doesn't start for another 5 months !!! As for Amershams not going to the city, I think you'll find 410-417 on the MF all visit Aldgate at least once! |
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Post by redsetter on Jul 8, 2011 13:59:06 GMT
its all those additional stops traveling down from amersham. wouldn't be surprised if chiltern are not packing them in instead to avoid the drag,chiltern will have the fast lines to themselves off peak. its supposed to be a line undergoing modernisation however journey times are increasing.
the days of 70mph services in the past are coming to an end.for the amersham user the A stock days' (or years') may well be seen as the lines heyday.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2011 14:13:15 GMT
its all those additional stops traveling down from amersham. wouldn't be surprised if chiltern are not packing them in instead to avoid the drag,chiltern will have the fast lines to themselves off peak. its supposed to be a line undergoing modernisation however journey times are increasing. the days of 70mph services in the past are coming to an end.for the amersham user the A stock days' (or years') may well be seen as the lines heyday. I'm no regular on the Met, but I've been to both Amersham and Chesham in the off peaks a couple of times a year over the last few years and you can literally count the passengers on one hand Why run empty trains when there may be a benefit to folks between Moor Park and HOH and more income generated? As for the extra journey time which I imagine will add on 5 minutes on an end to end journey, Amersham - Baker, I believe the Amershams and Cheshams run through to the city Anyone travelling from the stations Ricky and north of, will get to Euston, Kings X/St Pancras/Eurostar and Liverpool Street, just as quickly as taking a Chiltern to Marylebone and walking to Baker St, using the Bakerloo and changing once or twice again, with the added convenience of a through service to that busy group of stations I think there's too much emphasis here on the 'tradition' and 'halycon days' of the Met being a fast railway. They're empty trains these days between the peaks! Off peak to Amersham 25/30 years ago was 1tph fast with 1 tph BR and a Chesham shuttle connecting off them. How about a return to that!?! |
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Post by redsetter on Jul 8, 2011 14:56:04 GMT
chilterns coming down from aylesbury pick up a enough people to fill the two cars by the time it arrives at amersham.personally i get off and use the metropolitan line at that point yes because there's more space.
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metman
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Post by metman on Jul 8, 2011 17:02:04 GMT
My problem shedcompnodosh is that the Dec timetable introduces a complex pattern of services at I'm sure most timetable producers would agree is unwise. The pre 2001 timetable was just that. Watford trains alternating Aldagte/Baker Street. Some Uxbridge only going to Baker Street and an Amersham service swapping between Baker and the City. I'd have thought the best option was to run 8tph between Aldagte and Uxbridge and leave the rest alone!
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2011 9:28:33 GMT
My problem shedcompnodosh is that the Dec timetable introduces a complex pattern of services at I'm sure most timetable producers would agree is unwise. The pre 2001 timetable was just that. Watford trains alternating Aldagte/Baker Street. Some Uxbridge only going to Baker Street and an Amersham service swapping between Baker and the City. I'd have thought the best option was to run 8tph between Aldagte and Uxbridge and leave the rest alone! Metman, I wouldn't say it is a 'complex' pattern, just different, a 'change' to which many humans naturally resist ! Whilst the majority of folks on here understand the intricacies of the Met, many members of the general public, shall we say your average 'off peak' punters don't Whenever I talk to friends (who have no interest in LU/Railways) about the underground, the one line people pick out as not understanding/being slightly confused by is the Met, because the map splits it up as seperate fast/slow railways If anything, for the general public at least, the new pattern will be much simpler. Everything stops everywhere (apart from in the peaks), no need to worry about changing etc Presuming the timetable follows the standard model of even intervals over the trunk section (HOH - Baker), this section will now receive an even interval service of 3.5/4 minutes instead of the present 5 with 4 fast push ins every 10/20 The pattern of trains to Aldgate has chaged, but at the end of the day there will be more, so if you're train isn't an Aldgate simply take it to Baker St and change there, Uxbridge punters lose out by a couple of trains per hour, but a new avenue is opened to everyone in the Pinner group of stations, Moor Pk, Ricky and north of for through services The above statements are purely my thoughts on how the pattern shouldn't be seen as pants, just a 'change'. I think it will be a much simpler service for passengers who don't know the Met that well to understand Operationally is a different matter, ie things Met Control has touched on such as the new working at Watford South Junction That's where the timetable may pose problems But to dismiss it is 'pant's' 5 months before it operates seems to me a tad premature! |
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Post by citysig on Jul 9, 2011 10:02:52 GMT
It's another one of those "works on paper" timetables like the new Circle was. We'll see what happens on 11th September, and hope that any problems are foreseen before the full introduction.
I've given my concerns about Watford South Junction, too many trains on the locals, inter-woven Watford/Uxbridge services etc.etc. I think based on these concerns, some people are dismissing the timetable as a potential disaster.
Whatever the new service pattern brings, let us hope that the core timetable works. It's one thing to introduce something that isn't favoured, but at least works and runs to time, and another thing to have a disaster that nobody likes nor can manage.
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Post by citysig on Jul 13, 2011 20:34:40 GMT
(Having a job to decide which thread to shove info like this in, as it fits in more than 1  ) Another train will become S-stock worked from next week, with a further hopefully following the week after - but maybe more mid-week than the start of the week. Then all the workings will be shuffled slightly by the introduction of the new Working Timetable from 31st July. I will update all the workings as and when they become applicable and/or known. |
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