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Post by jardine01 on Jul 10, 2011 13:02:29 GMT
Does the 96 stock have regenitive brakes? also when does the new timetable start?
Thanks
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Post by br7mt on Jul 10, 2011 15:53:27 GMT
Limited to rheostatic brakes at the moment. Regenerative braking is a weekend or two away, just got to dot the i's and cross the t's as regards assurance and then do the software change (to traction software version 6). It was tested on Sunday 3rd July to great success I understand.
Not sure when the new timetable starts now, think it has been delayed while arrangements are put in place to ensure sufficient trains are available for the service.
Regards,
Dan
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Post by jardine01 on Jul 10, 2011 17:00:43 GMT
So Is this Traction software version 6 some kind of prefomance upgrade? If it is a preformance upgrade what is the 96 stock like with Full Prefomance quick off the mark like the 1992 stock?
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Post by br7mt on Jul 10, 2011 21:37:52 GMT
Version 6 is basically the current 96TS full performance with regenerative braking enabled. Version 7 is the enhanced performance plus regen braking, which will come at a later date. Enhanced performance is higher acceleration rate when empty plus a longer period of acceleration at the existing rate when full, but I would have to check that to be certain. Basically the trains can get back to the central core much faster i.e. when carrying less passengers.
Afraid I don't know enough about 92TS to compare.
Regards,
Dan
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Post by Deleted on Jul 11, 2011 16:41:35 GMT
How is the 'empty' performance mode selected? Would have thought it might be the other way round. I. E. Enhanced performance when full and normal rate when empty to compensate for the additional weight? Not sure how much faster these might accelerate, as they are pretty quick as it is. Plus are there any sections where the full 60mph top speed can be exploited? Haven't seen more than 50mph maximum out in the open sections!
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Post by Deleted on Jul 11, 2011 18:37:25 GMT
I wonder if the track can handle all that speed, should be fun flying over all the block joints on the old section  ;D |
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Post by jardine01 on Jul 11, 2011 18:43:23 GMT
When is this Prefomance uprade going to start? is this when the new timetable starts? Or at a later date? However with 4/7 cars being motored I cant see that much prefomance upgrade from what it already is. The Central line has 8/8 motored axles
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Post by Deleted on Jul 11, 2011 19:50:42 GMT
They may have all axels motorised, but, the 96 stock with its more advanced technology may make up for that.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 11, 2011 20:00:37 GMT
I think you'll find 96ts has a total motor power of 1440kW, whereas the 92ts has 1472kW. 92s still have better power to weight though, despite the extra car, because they were built so light. 8.140kW/ton and 8.659kW/ton respectively. The 96's LT200 motors are just under double (90kw) of the 46kW LT130s on the 92ts.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 11, 2011 22:31:52 GMT
It appears to me that more time could be gained through faster station approaches and remodelling junctions to eliminate low speed restrictions. I. E exit from Stanmore limited to 15mph over the points from platform 2 southbound. I like the fact that at Leytonstone on the Central line, trains starting from the Hainault platform towards London can accelerate to full line speed and traverse the junction onto the main running line without slowing down. Also there are issues when trains run too close to one another. I was on Central line Sun evening and we were constantly bring checked/ brought to a halt between stations due to the preceding train in front! It will be interesting to see how the jubillee line fares with it's more intensive timetable!
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Post by Deleted on Jul 11, 2011 22:34:56 GMT
I'm sure regen braking rate is lower than discs alone, but not sur ehow superior regen plus discs are over disc only.
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Post by jardine01 on Jul 12, 2011 6:17:48 GMT
Its going to be pritty annoying if the trains are stop starting all the time and i guess it will be more on off motion as the train tries to keep to target speed?
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Post by Bighat on Jul 12, 2011 7:41:28 GMT
It appears to me that more time could be gained through faster station approaches and remodelling junctions to eliminate low speed restrictions. I. E exit from Stanmore limited to 15mph over the points from platform 2 southbound. I like the fact that at Leytonstone on the Central line, trains starting from the Hainault platform towards London can accelerate to full line speed and traverse the junction onto the main running line without slowing down. Also there are issues when trains run too close to one another. I was on Central line Sun evening and we were constantly bring checked/ brought to a halt between stations due to the preceding train in front! It will be interesting to see how the jubillee line fares with it's more intensive timetable! But on Sundays on the Central Line,don't they run in coded manual on the open air sections? That would cause the distance between trains to be greater than in full ATO. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2011 7:51:06 GMT
Sun I travelled from Stratford to Central London, so mainly tunnel!
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2011 13:08:24 GMT
Anyone know how much faster the Stanmore to Stratford timetable will be with the performance upgrade? I doubt there would be more than 5 mins improvement end to end!
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2011 18:01:41 GMT
IIRC, an official figure of four minutes was given.
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Post by greatkingrat on Jul 12, 2011 18:59:20 GMT
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Post by jardine01 on Jul 12, 2011 19:42:47 GMT
Really the 12-13 minutes reduction in journey times us unrelaistic yes journey times will be cut compared due to ATO operation. But if the train is very busy and is stop start that is quite a few minutes wasted. When the new timetable comes speed and prefomance should inprove greatly.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2011 19:45:58 GMT
So approx 30 secs off each station to station section then. Hmm guess that station dwell time will have to be reduced too to achieve this, plus possibly higher speeds on the longer sections?
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Post by Chris M on Jul 12, 2011 23:05:29 GMT
If the current Jubilee timetable has as much slack in it as the District one does then getting rid of that would significantly help towards the claimed end-to-end journey time improvement
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Post by v52gc on Jul 13, 2011 7:33:08 GMT
I think reduced platform passenger waiting times are included in the percentage figure, not just the time spent on the train.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 13, 2011 15:24:53 GMT
Average dwell time on my last trip was 30 seconds, so if this could be cut by - say 10 seconds - on average - then you could cut the end to end journey time by 4 mins. Prob 2 mins from each extremity into central London. Plus I don't think we ran flat out by any means. Judging by pitch of the motors , 50 mph only used between bermondsey and London bridge. And then again from neasden to wembley park and then on the sections north of wembley park. Quite slow running from baker street to neasden although very short distances noted between some stations. Does anyone know what the line speed profile will be for the new timetable?
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Post by jardine01 on Jul 13, 2011 19:52:46 GMT
Not sure what the line speed will be with the new timetable? I would say no more than 62mph maybe on long sections like canada water to Canary Wharf.
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Post by br7mt on Jul 13, 2011 20:17:54 GMT
The line speed will not change, what will change is the ability to reach that line speed based on the safety distance to the train in front.
Regards,
Dan
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Post by Deleted on Jul 13, 2011 20:59:07 GMT
Does anyone know what current speed limits are on the jubilee.? Clearly the upper limit is 50mph presently but wonder if that will increase bearing in mind trains design speed? I can't see lower end acceleration being improved much , 0-30 mph takes around 15 sec at present. Acceleration rate over 30 mph seems to tail off markedly.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 13, 2011 22:01:18 GMT
Anyone know how much faster the Stanmore to Stratford timetable will be with the performance upgrade? I doubt there would be more than 5 mins improvement end to end! I think several issues are being rolled together here. The main performance upgrade is already on the trains; the further tweaks are for full regen capability and a further small tweak to performance. The new TT at the end of July should reduce run times by around 6% (as it was originally written expecting a PM service) and the next TT in March a further 6% ish. I have a copy of WTT11 at work. I will post the end to end comparisons when I get a mo. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 14, 2011 8:07:27 GMT
Current public TT is around 65 min end to end, so a 4 min improvement then at 6%. I think easily achieved with more flat out running at current speed limits. Be interesting to see a full timetable showing where the extra minutes will be saved compared to current.
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Post by jardine01 on Aug 2, 2011 17:33:29 GMT
Now the new timetable is in use are all trains now going flat out between stations? Well St Johns wood to Baker street the other day was very on off power all of the time. I know i have asked this question before but is there any infomation on when PM is Used?
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Post by br7mt on Aug 2, 2011 21:20:49 GMT
At the risk of repeating myself again - PM mode is only used to work around a defect or when workers are trackside and ATO is inhibited. There is no plan, as far as I am aware, to force PM working at weekends. We have had instances of TOs running in PM mode when the rheo / regen brake has developed a fault, and to move forward when an undershoot occurs, but that is about all.
Regards,
Dan
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;D
