Next Train Indicators/Central Line

[jamesb]

At either Chigwell or Grange Hill there are new different-looking next train indicator's installed on both platforms. They have been there for a while and last time I passed weren't switched on.

Does anybody know if they are planning to replace the next train indicators on the Central Line/why they have been installed but not switched on at just one station?

There doesn't look anything wrong with the ones presently in use!

[Deleted]

The new ones can display the next 4 trains, as opposed to three currently... They are also much brighter and clearer than the old ones, and are easier to clean the muck off the front glass...

It's all very well until the sun shines on them!

[ongarparknride]

Oh dear, I might get banned for this comment.

If they can come up with train indicators accurately predicting the next 4 trains, I kinda get the feeling the passengers (let alone the drivers) at Earl's Court might be a higher priority than Grange Hill !!!



Sorry. :-)

OngarParkNRide

[Deleted]

As well all know, the Central Line with it's modern signaling has probably the best and most accurate Next Train indicators.

The contract to install and maintain the Dot Matrix Indicators (DMI) changed nearly 2 years ago. As with most things electrical alot of the parts used in the current DMI's are out of date and obsolete.

Newly fitted DMI's will be installed as the stations have their refurbs.

Another station that had new DMI's was Stockwell. The present Vic & Northern Line ones were replaced by these new models.

Earl's court next train indicators are unique and I'm sure everyone would love DMI's probably except English Heritage.

Things should be a bit better at Earls Court as Trackernet has spread there, so the control room staff should have a better idea of trains etc

[ongarparknride]

ps: Yes, I think that certain train indicators are almost "protected heritage", and ought to be.

It is a pity H&S etc. prevent obsolete LU history, property, fittings and rolling stock being more accessible to properly organised and supervised access by serious enthusiasts.

Unfortunately, one of these days whatever remaining access rights will be privatized off and subsequently operated as successfully as a theme park - at a price many of us won't be able to afford.

Awww shucks..... it's been years since I last visited the LT museum at Covent Garden; never been able yet to visit an open day at Acton; and ditto many years since I was last able to afford to visit the York National Railway Museum.

sob, sob,


There's a thread here currently running about the Kingsway Tram Subway and the "Disappearing London" TV series.... with considerable interest despite the OP saying it isn't strictly to do with the Underground, nor specifically the District Line :-)


Apart from scrapping the "old" 1950's - 1960's Central Line (and probably LT's "standard") next train passenger advisory box, where is the information on the circuitry by which it was fed and operated? Guess I'd better go to look for a more appropriate thread here.... :-)


cheers,
OngarParkNRide

[ongarparknride]

Hi, central-simon,
I just saw your reply 8 minutes b4 mine when I posted my last, re: what you say about English Heritage. Thank gawd it isn't called British Heritage. Or is that racism these days

:-)

I'm glad you are so keen on DMI's. Obviously 'Artery' Train Op's post is completely out of order as on a "proper" underground railway, the sun wouldn't be shining on your DMI's in the first place. :-) Hhhhmmmmm..... where do I recollect the expression "cut and cover" from?

And needing to have open air access to let the steam and smoke escape? Like, that might just involve the Sun shining on it? Guess the decision to install DMI's might cost £ 10m


Flogging off the remaining open air sections of the LU cut and cover lines for redevelopment and concreting over like Barbican/Moorgate..... £ 4b ? But look at what you can rent the resulting skyscapers out for!

Anyone got any links to technical discussion of LED technology -v- the traditional backlighting of destination signs? I guess the LED's are more versatile in being programmable.


How long, I wonder, before TfL sells advertising on these new DMI's like the Post Office introduced to keep the punters happy whilst queuing a few years ago.

An entire New Industry could arise in the on-line gaming industry......

"Next Train to Cockfosters will arrive in 7 minutes"
"Place your bets now when it will actually open its doors at this station"



Cheers,
:-)
OngarParkNRide

[Deleted]

My interest in DMI's is mostly they make my life sooooo much easier. Plus we've all waited at a station with no DMI's and it's a right pain not knowing how long until your next train.

Heritage features like Earl's Court are important and must be retained, however we mustn't forget that the railway is operational and expectations for information increase/ change.

I can remember the old style next train boards at the south end of the Northern & on the Central and must admit they do invoke a sense of nostalga.

The LT musuem & Acton are IMHO very good at protecting LU's heritage, BUT we mustn't forget that we should also create a heritage for tommorrow.

[Chris M]

ongarparknride said:

re: what you say about English Heritage. Thank gawd it isn't called British Heritage. Or is that racism these days

It is called English Heritage because it covers England.
Scotland is covered by Historic Scotland and Cadw: Welsh Historic Monuments is responsible for Wales.
I can't remember the name of the Northern Ireland equivalent, but the Isle of Man body is Manx Heritage iirc.

[chrish]

centralsimon said:

Earl's court next train indicators are unique and I'm sure everyone would love DMI's probably except English Heritage.

Things should be a bit better at Earls Court as Trackernet has spread there, so the control room staff should have a better idea of trains etc

Hi All,

Finally got round to saying something on here!

I work as a CSA at Earls Court, and unfortunately, Trackernet does have a limited use at the station. Whereas we can see all the way to Upminster through the city to find trains, we can still only see as far as High Street Kensington on the Edgware Road branch, so Wimbledon trains can be hard to find, especially after about 2300 when the last Wimbledon via the city leaves.

Also, the main time when a newer platform indicator would be helpful is during disruption, at which time trains have a nasty habit of being reformed whilst along side the platforms at Earls Court.

Personally, I think that this may lead to more problems when trains change.

Chris

[ongarparknride]

Thanks, Chris M, « Reply #7 on Jan 27, 2007, 2:33pm »

Hiya chrish... You might not know of Jerome K. Jerome's novel "Three Men In A Boat (not to mention the dog)" - Methinks the inspiration for his tipping the driver in that book to go to the destination he wanted was based in Real Life at Earl's Court Station, and not, from memory, Paddington.

Cheers, all

:-)

[Deleted]

them signs at earls court are in fact coming down for a short period soon as they also need a spot of TLC but they will be going back up but a modern dmi will replacing them whilst they are away for referb

[Deleted]

Permanent modern DMIs near the Warwick Road entrance would be greatly beneficial at Earl's Ct, as the old signs are not visible from the bottom of the steps at that end of the station.

[Deleted]

not since they put them lifts in no they not plus all the scaffolding now makes it very difficult

[Deleted]

aetearlscourt said:

them signs at earls court are in fact coming down for a short period soon as they also need a spot of TLC but they will be going back up but a modern dmi will replacing them whilst they are away for referb

I sense a conspiracy here - public will love the DMI (especially if it actually gives correct information) and the old destination board will find itself at Acton or relocated at Earl's Court.

[Deleted]

stephenk said:

Permanent modern DMIs near the Warwick Road entrance would be greatly beneficial at Earl's Ct, as the old signs are not visible from the bottom of the steps at that end of the station.

Well, not too near or the train will have gone before the customer can reach it

[gavelex]

got these at East Acton too.

[Deleted]

gavelex said:

got these at East Acton too.

DMI's in the booking hall? West Acton has them, never knew East Acton had them.

Good idea IMHO

[gavelex]

centralsimon said:

gavelex said:

got these at East Acton too.

DMI's in the booking hall? West Acton has them, never knew East Acton had them.

Good idea IMHO

yep, ive only seen the platform ones though.

[Colin]

centralsimon said:

I sense a conspiracy here - public will love the DMI (especially if it actually gives correct information) and the old destination board will find itself at Acton or relocated at Earl's Court.

I have a sneaking suspicion that these boards will not show trains in the context of minutes away as the area just doesn't work like that - I hope I'm wrong though

Incidentally, when I worked on the station side at Earls Court, it was often mooted that there would be modern DMI's going in at both ends of both platforms and that they would work in tandem with the original - crish, as you are now currently based there, is that still the eventual plan?

[Deleted]

I'd guess it would all depend on how the info is fed into the DMI. Using existing feeds or something completely different.

[Deleted]

innocentabroad said:

stephenk said:

Permanent modern DMIs near the Warwick Road entrance would be greatly beneficial at Earl's Ct, as the old signs are not visible from the bottom of the steps at that end of the station.

Well, not too near or the train will have gone before the customer can reach it

I meant putting the DMI on the platform at the bottom of the steps (from where the old indicators arn't visible).

[Harsig]

colin said:

centralsimon said:

I sense a conspiracy here - public will love the DMI (especially if it actually gives correct information) and the old destination board will find itself at Acton or relocated at Earl's Court.

I have a sneaking suspicion that these boards will not show trains in the context of minutes away as the area just doesn't work like that - I hope I'm wrong though

I should be very surprised if you were wrong. Part of the problem is that predicting acurately platform usage at Earls Court is almost impossible until the very last minute. In the case of trains coming from South Ken or West Ken/Olympia you can never be sure until the signals are actually cleared which platform they will go into and in the case of trains from Wimbledon or High St Ken, although the platform is not in doubt, you can't be sure until the signals are cleared that this will be the next train in that platform as something could be signalled in from South Ken/West Ken in front of them.
The best solution to this sort of problem, in my opinion is the one adopted on the Met platforms at Baker St. In most cases, as at Earls Court the individual platform describers do not show trains until it is certain that they will be next in that platform. However there are separate displays showing the next few departures from the station with the predicted minutes away. This display is repeated on all platforms and the booking hall area (and in the SCC at Baker St) and only indicates which platform the train will depart from once this has been determined beyond doubt.
As it stands though, I doubt the existing train describer system at Earls Court could support such a system