Baker Street insanity

[Deleted]

Whoever (whomever?) decided that current segregated passenger flows at Baker Street are a good idea must have their brains checked...

Most of people who used temporary closed escalators were either tourists or locals - and both of these cannot cause any overcrowding as tourists just go to wherever the new signage will point them to and so do the locals who already know about the closure.

However new passenger flow forces everyone to use footbridges over the Met which IMHO makes the problem worse by forcing everyone on the stairs in addition to people entering the station.

[Deleted]

Many, mnay years ago when they were rebuilding Paddington we had passenger flow from the one direction only during the morning peak on the passage between the "Lawn" and the Bakerloo Line, that was imposed by HMRI so possibly the current situation at Baker Street was to meet the requirements of ORR.

[class411]

Sometimes you think these things are planned by someone with zero sense.

When Hammersmith ( D & P) was remodelled, quite some years back, now, they attempted to impose a one way system that was exactly the wrong way around.

People entering the station would use the exit route because it was obviously the quickest route to their train. On the other hand, people exiting the station would tend to use the entry route because the stairs for that, although marked 'No Exit', where the first ones most passengers would encounter and the correct exit stairs were masked by t he entry ones.

This lead to a persistent situation where passengers using the station 'correctly' would be battling against those using it 'incorrectly'. To make matters worse, they helpfully set some of t he automatic barriers so that people could easily go the wrong way.

It took them many years but eventually they noticed the problem and changed the routes - also enforcing it by not having gates set to allow people to go the wrong way.

[Deleted]

Both escalator 5&6 have been taken out of service together and can't be used as a fixed staircase. This has resulted in the only way to gain entry/ exit into the Jubilee/ Bakerloo Lines is via the Met line platforms.

Detailed modelling of queue times indicated very early on that the stairs leading down to the circulating area from platforms 3/4 could not cope with the extra demands placed upon them.

Another key problem is the circulating area leading UP to the Metropolitan Line platforms.

This logically lead to an introduction of a one way system during the peaks in which passengers leaving the tube part of the station do so via Plats 1/2 and those entering the tube area do so via plats 3/4.

The only passengers who are forced "up and over" are those Met passengers arriving into platform 1 who need the Bakerloo/ Jubilee and those arriving on the jubilee / bakerloo wanting platform 4. This interchange would easily be done at Finchley Road and you would suspect this to become the preferred method if delays occur.

This was the only way, after extensive modelling, that the Bakerloo/ Jubilee lines could keep stopping during the peak hours.

I don't recognise the belief that only tourists would enter/ exit Baker Street using the escalators. While Baker Street is primarily an interchange station - the 20-25 million entry/ exits with the Bakerloo line gateline being the busier of the 3 available, these additional people using the Met platforms necessitated the need for the current arrangements.

[littlebrute]

I will say, for uni, up until the works began I would usually change at Baker Street for the Bakerloo, but now after my particularly interesting experience yesterday, I'll either change at Finchley Road or get off at Great Portland Street and walk. It's an utter shambles.

[Deleted]

Can I suggest anybody who feels strongly make a formal complaint. Sadly in a public forum I can't say anymore on the subject.

[Tubeboy]

Nov 1, 2012 19:41:22 GMT @centralsimon said:

Can I suggest anybody who feels strongly make a formal complaint. Sadly in a public forum I can't say anymore on the subject.

I do hope "my gift" is adapting to the new arrangements there! ;D

[manorborn]

Can anyone explain what is happening - both the steps down to the Met lines, and from the Met platforms to the lower circulating area for the Jubilee/Bakerloo are one way some of the time - this afternoon for example staff were blocking off the main steps down to platforms 1 and 2. Is this permanent? It could be a real pain to arrive on the Bakerloo and have to come up to platform 2 and then cross by the footbridge to get on a northbound Met leaving on 4 (makes glad that I am pretty well retired from daily commuting on that route).

<<Rincew1nd - Edit: Moved from Met' Board to this existing thread on the Jub' Board>>

[Deleted]

Didn't someone already post about this?

[manorborn]

Sorry - if they did I didn't see it

[Deleted]

Escalator work. Historically you would have non stopped the Bakerloo & jubilee lines or only work on one escalator at a time. Extensive modelling indicated that the staircases to/ from the middle circulating areas could not cope with 2 way traffic if both escalators were removed at the same time. Sadly there is no easy way to conduct extensive works and you are massively reliant on the public adjusting their travelling habits.

The majority of northbound Mets leave from plats 1/2 and there is advice to take the first train and change.

Removing both escalators at the same time has significantly reduced the time taken, albeit in a more significantly degraded operation, and has provided with significant cost savings.

[Chris M]

Nov 27, 2012 17:32:44 GMT @81stock said:

Didn't someone already post about this?

Yes, the thread is entitled "Baker Street Insanity" and is in the Jubilee line section.

[rsdworker]

i remember once time i was on train (jubbiee line) we non stopped through baker street platform due escalator works

[metrider]

A few days before this started I was handed a leaflet as I changed from the Bakerloo to northbound Met. I thought would cause much more difficulty for me that it actually has.

The plus point is that with one way in action on the stairs up to to the met platforms, those stairs actually are less much congested.

Yes, platform 4 departures are hit and miss whether you catch it, and I'd think twice about being on a train that terminated at Baker street, but thankfully for me most of the southbound met trains I use tend to be Aldgate's at the time I need them.

[Deleted]

What proportion of northbound Mets start from platform 4 at Baker Street? Why not just run them empty to Finchley Road?

[manorborn]

Nov 27, 2012 18:38:18 GMT Chris M said:

Nov 27, 2012 17:32:44 GMT @81stock said:

Didn't someone already post about this?

Yes, the thread is entitled "Baker Street Insanity" and is in the Jubilee line section.

Thanks - I don't travel on the Jubbly so didn't read the original thread

[rincew1nd]

With a wave of my magic wand, Met' thread merged into existing Jubilee Line thread.

[metrider]

Nov 27, 2012 18:54:41 GMT @innocentabroad said:

What proportion of northbound Mets start from platform 4 at Baker Street? Why not just run them empty to Finchley Road?

errrrr... Why?
The way it is, the passenger has a choice whether to change at Finchley road take a train that is on (or may end up on) platform 4. You'd just be taking away that choice.

[Deleted]

I arrive on the Jubilee each morning and exit to the street (and, obviously, vice versa in the afternoon) - usually more like peak-shoulder than high-peak. And I can honestly say I haven't noticed any more crowding than usual; certainly by a 10am arrival the station's positively quiet. I was expecting massive disruption and the need to walk from a different station, but not at all. Take that, doomsayers!

[Ben]

What are the announcements like at Finchley Road? I hope they are 'robust' wrt changing there instead and that the TOps are making manual announcements? Just a shame all the automatic ones detract focus...

[metrider]

Nov 28, 2012 14:23:59 GMT Ben said:

What are the announcements like at Finchley Road? I hope they are 'robust' wrt changing there instead and that the TOps are making manual announcements? Just a shame all the automatic ones detract focus...

I've not been on a Platform 4 terminator since the one-way system was introduced, but have not heard any announcements on Aldgate services that run through Platform 3 (Nor are any needed with the possible exception of P4 terminators)

I have heard announcements on the Northbound Bakerloo at Regents Park (which is within walking distance of Baker Street.

Really the only need for an announcement at Finchley road would be to advise passengers to step back to a closely following Aldgate service. Otherwise travelling forward will give many more options for travel even further forward!.