Rebuilding of White Hart Lane

[Deleted]

TfL have released images showing the design for the planned £17.8 million re-development of the London Overground station at White Hart Lane which is due for completion by spring 2019 bringing step-free access (street to platform) as well as a much needed enlarged station layout. The contract has been awarded to Taylor Woodrow responsible for the upgrade works at Tottenham Court Road and Victoria tube stations.

[waysider]

I saw these at a local plan consultation a few years ago and was quite disappointed.
The new station building is about 50-100 yards north of the present one, with its big difference being two staircases on the London-bound platform instead of one and really no changed for the northbound platform. I pointed out that until the early 1980s there used to be a second set of stairs at the southern end of the platforms that used to exit onto Whitehall Street, behind the now-closed British Queen pub ...the spokesman had now idea.
One thing he DID say that was interesting was that when redesigning the station they discovered the arches beneath the station building (as seen on the picture behind the three pink trees) are not true arches going through to the other side - they are just fronts onto an earth embankment!

[stapler]

Fronts onto an embankment...that's quite common. St James St on the Chingford branch, built at much the same time, is exactly similar.

[Ben]

waysider its fairly common that the people they send to these things have limited knowledge or background of the route. Went to an HS2 consultation once, spoke to a guy who'd done 30 years in the railways etc etc, wasn't aware the NNML had any services over it, wasn't familiar with the Greenford loop. His thing might very well have been the history of the Potteries loop signalling, or house colours of the North British, but its not exactly confidence inspiring when they are there to talk about a project and its issues but when something is raised which has a tangible connection or relevance to it the answer comes back as 'don't know' or 'hmmm'. Such is the industry now.

Incidentally, the second picture looks like theyve designed a perfect wind funnel at the nearest end of the platform. Why can't anyone design weather protection that protects you from the weather anymore?

[silverfoxcc]

Waysider.

The 'new build' is in fact South of the present station on the up side
I cannot remember any second stairway on the up side at all in all my years of using the station. However there was a second stairway on the down platform which was about halfway along and exited alongside the original stairs onto White Hart Lane and was used only during Spurs home matches.
I also understand that there was talk at one point that there was going to be a aerial walkway from the ground to the station going over Tottenham high road,but it looks from the plans and drawing that is now dropped

[waysider]

Yes silverfox, of course its south ...not concentrating there!
And yes, the now-gone football staircase was only on the southbound platforms... never worked out why they were removed?

[silverfoxcc]

Waysider

Northbound!!!! Yes i never knew why they were taken out as thre trains were quite wedged and splitting the exit groups halfway along cleared the platforms a bit quicker. Now there are instances where the rear of the last trains occupants havent got to the exit and are then added to by the next train emptying. god knows how they are going to cope when the capacity doubles next year
I just hope that someone suddenly wakes up and gets the soutbound Stansteds to stop at Park. They do it on some northbound before the game but it is going to be chaos for a few months until everything is organised. My son is absolutely spitting feathers as the opportunity is there at WHL to add a bay on the london side so at least a shuttle of some short could be run, if only down to seven sisters and back in between the rather laughable service they put on now.
When the service was first introduced waaaay back in Nov 60 there were 9 trains an hour from Lower Edmonton, 0.20.40 fast to L Street
3.23 34 all station stoppers,13.33.53 all stations to Hackney downs then fast to LS. Surely it it not beyond the wit of man to get something like than put in for an hour or so after the game to clear the crowd. I always thought that LUL could have put an island platform in at Park to take a lot of the crowd straight onto the Vic line. With the re installation of the four track, eventually, it could still be done. We are lagging well behind the German system such as Bayern Munich and other stadia where trains appear out of nowhere to shift the crowds. Still no doubt some pessimist old b*gger will say it cant be done due to elfnsafty and lack of platforms.at LS

[waysider]

incidentally, we only have a few more months of 'White Hart Lane'. The station will be renamed 'Tottenham Hptspur' when the new (as yet unnamed stadium) opens this summer

[revupminster]

Feb 3, 2018 9:54:23 GMT waysider said:

incidentally, we only have a few more months of 'White Hart Lane'. The station will be renamed 'Tottenham Hptspur' when the new (as yet unnamed stadium) opens this summer

Is this wishful thinking. In 2016 it was estimated the cost to Spurs of 12 million and there is a petition to stop the renaming.

[waysider]

where the figure of £12m comes from is beyond me as I have read that too? Surely LU didn't find themselves with £12m worth of costs when they changed Shepherds Bush to 'Shepherds Bush Market?'

I had a look at the petition ...just some anorak fan, not local residents, so I wouldn't take any notice.

[Chris M]

The costs associated with changing a station name will include:
Changing all the signage at the station
Changing all the signage at other stations on the route to reflect the new name
Changing DMIs at stations and on trains
Recording new audio announcements for trains and stations, and updating the existing ones.
Changing maps and other publicity
Changing signalling diagrams (and possibly other bits of signalling kit), sectional diagrams, etc.
Publicity about the name change
Making sure all the emergency services in the area formally know of the name change

and probably several things I haven't thought of, but I can't say whether all this totals £12m (a figure which this news article attributes to TfL)

For a London Overground station Network Rail will have to bear many of these costs, and presumably TfL would have to pay NR if they want to change a name. Network Rail were quoted as saying that renaming Blackfriars station was not financially justifiable "in this age of austerity" but I can't find any actual figures quoted after a short google.

[waysider]

change the name 'Blackfriars' to what?

[Chris M]

When the new entrance on the south side of the river opened, people wanted the name of the station to reflect that although there wasn't (AFIAK) a consensus on what the new name should be constructions like "Blackfriars and Bankside" or "Blackfriars and South Bank" were suggested. There was no proposal to rename the tube station that I'm aware of.

[norbitonflyer]

Feb 4, 2018 11:36:08 GMT Chris M said:

When the new entrance on the south side of the river opened, people wanted the name of the station to reflect that although there wasn't (AFIAK) a consensus on what the new name should be constructions like "Blackfriars and Bankside" or "Blackfriars and South Bank" were suggested.

When it opened in the 1880s, Blackfriars (LCDR) station was named "St Pauls", replacing the 1864 station on the South Bank which had been called "Blackfriars Bridge" It was renamed by the Southern Railway in 1937, as part of a tidying up of names in the area which also involved the renaming of "Post Office" Tube station to its present name of St Pauls.

[Dom K]

Back on topic please

I read that the LO is closed between Hackney Downs and Enfield Town/Cheshunt to enable track works and station works at White Hart Lane.

I guess the rebuild has started, although it is running very late for the Stadium opening in August