LU film

[silverfoxcc]

I subscribe to a site called ians visits .... gives lots of info about talks walks and exhibitions in/around London

This weeks post mentioned this link

www.ianvisits.co.uk/blog/2019/11/05/see-the-london-underground-as-it-was-in-the-1960s-and-70s/?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=weeklyemailblog

Perhaps some on here might be able to give locations etc

[revupminster]

I've only looked at the second film because interspersed were parts of the Department S episode Last Train to Redbridge.

It's a classic Department S story about why was the guard and passengers in the last car murdered and Jason King to end up drugged at disused Post Office Station with second world war posters to be saved by Sullivan and Hurst. It's on youtube.


One of the best theme tunes Edwin Astley wrote and he wrote some of the most famous of the 60's.

[goldenarrow]

Video 1

Starting of at Seven Sisters?

Then a train pulling into Green Park.

Then the Northern line (Edgware Branch?).

Back to the VIC where I can just make out the “High Bury” of Highbury & Islington.

Double barrel escalators could be Oxford Circus.

The crowds coming off the train might well be the Central Line Eastbound at the same station.

Back to a double barrel I think at the same again.


Video 2

All the shots focusing on the guard are at Aldwych. You can see how hesitantly the train pulls forward just to get out of shot as there is not much track left!

[countryman]

Nov 7, 2019 23:02:45 GMT goldenarrow said:

Video 1

Starting of at Seven Sisters?

Then a train pulling into Green Park.

Then the Northern line (Edgware Branch?).

Back to the VIC where I can just make out the “High Bury” of Highbury & Islington.

Double barrel escalators could be Oxford Circus.

The crowds coming off the train might well be the Central Line Eastbound at the same station.

Back to a double barrel I think at the same again.


Video 2

All the shots focusing on the guard are at Aldwych. You can see how hesitantly the train pulls forward just to get out of shot as there is not much track left!

I thought it odd that the shots were at Aldwych, as the number on the DM is 1751. As this is a 62 stock number, and, as far as I was aware, the 62 stock only ran on the Central Line in the 60s, I was a little dubious. So I managed to dig out my Ian Allan London Transport Locomotives ans Rolling Stock book (can't find a date but the cover picture is dated 1965, price 4/6 so prior to 1971), and was surprise to find 1751 not on the Central list, the highest number listed being 1749. So I checked the Piccadilly entry, as this was the only place I thought I'd find it. And there it was, as far as I know, the only, to that date, 3 car 62 stock unit. (1750, 2750, 1751) The other thing that is unusual is that in the video car 1751 is adjacent to car 2750, normally an odd numbered DM would be coupled to an odd numbered NDM, such as 1749 and 9749. 

So, was this unit originally formed as a 4 car unit for the Central, then transferred with the removal of car 9751 to the Piccadilly. I travelled to school every day on the Central, and my recollection is that 1750-1751 was on the Central during my time (1964-1971)

[whistlekiller2000]

Nov 8, 2019 9:07:31 GMT countryman said:

So, was this unit originally formed as a 4 car unit for the Central, then transferred with the removal of car 9751 to the Piccadilly. I travelled to school every day on the Central, and my recollection is that 1750-1751 was on the Central during my time (1964-1971)

No, it was ordered as a 3 car unit (without an Non Driving Motor) in addition to the Central Line 1962ts order specifically for the Aldwych shuttle.

[revupminster]

The Department S episode was filmed at Aldwych late 1968/early 1969 broadcast 14 January 1970. The open section was filmed near White City when it was more open. The series was made back to back with Randall and Hopkirk (Deceased).

[norbitonflyer]

I don't think it was exclusively used on the shuttle though - a 3car 1959 unit could be substituted when 1750 was being overhauled or otherwise hors de combat. I don't know whether it was ever used, or even could be used, with a 4car 1959 stock unit to form a 7 car train on the Picadilly's main line.

[countryman]

Nov 8, 2019 14:14:23 GMT norbitonflyer said:

I don't think it was exclusively used on the shuttle though - a 3car 1959 unit could be substituted when 1750 was being overhauled or otherwise hors de combat. I don't know whether it was ever used, or even could be used, with a 4car 1959 stock unit to form a 7 car train on the Picadilly's main line.

I read on here that 59 and 62 stock, although different in some respects, were compatible to run together, and, in fact, did so on the Northern Line after the mid 90s. That is assuming that there was no specific reason why the 1750-1751 unit was significantly different from the 3 car 59 stock.

[miff]

The Squarewheels ‘62 stock web page says after 1979 this unit transferred to the Northern Line and worked with the ‘59 stock for 10 years then picked up a fourth car from somewhere and moved to the Central Line for a period before ending its career back on the Northern.

[hobbayne]

Nice clean 62 stock.

[theblackferret]

Dec 29, 2019 11:00:03 GMT hobbayne said:

Nice clean 62 stock.

Thanks for putting this up-there's an evening paper billboard 'Kray's Trail Latest' which does indeed date part of it to 1968 (it started in May of that year). And later on, there's a Pimlico station roundel clearly visible as a train goes by (opened 1972), so it's a compilation set.

I was fascinated by the way some participants kept appearing twice early on in this & with the non-existent soundtrack and the film sprocket-holes in the intervals between takes, it looks like the art school played a big part in this production.

So nostalgia and entertainment on film and tube stock front in one-thanks again

[Chris W]

The area around the 'London Underground' text alongside the DM's always seemed to be far darker in the late 1980s early 90s when I used the trains. I thought that this was due to the length of time that it has been since the letters had been applied, however for me, it's interesting that even in this far earlier footage, these same areas were noticeably darker...

Aluminium corrosion...??

Thoughts...

[Dstock7080]

Dec 29, 2019 21:45:09 GMT Chris W said:

The area around the 'London Underground' text alongside the DM's always seemed to be far darker in the late 1980s early 90s when I used the trains. I thought that this was due to the length of time that it has been since the letters had been applied, however for me, it's interesting that even in this far earlier footage, these same areas were noticeably darker...

Aluminium corrosion...??

Thoughts...

Hopefully they read “LONDON TRANSPORT” in the early days of ‘62, only ‘67 ‘72 mk I and C Stock had “UNDERGROUND” lettering, until the later roundels.

It think it’s simply the border to the transfer, they weren’t individual letters.

[countryman]

A fascinating film that brought back memories. A couple of things stand out t me. I used the Central line in the late 60s to go to school. I remember the seat velour to be red on the 62 stock on the Central; were they blue on the 59 stock on the Piccadilly?

The train in the scenes with the guard has cars with numbers 2750 and 1751. This indicates that the train is the special 3 car 62 stock unit used on the Piccadilly, and would suggest that the footage was taken at Aldwych. If you look carefully at 5:40 it appears to be fitted with line diagrams for the Central and Piccadilly lines.

[bigvern]

Some 1962 Tube Stock had a London Transport transfer which was comprised of a two piece rectangular silver sticker with red lettering outlined in black which came in two parts, where as the 1959 Stock had London Transport as a Transfer in two sections with individual letters, this is the reason why the sticker area appears darker as the aluminium oxidises and the sticker retained its silver colour on some 1962 Stock trains.
The outline of the transfers always remained visible as a shadow because the aluminium was washed with phosphoric acid to keep it clean and as a result etched the surface.
I think a similar situation existed on the A Stock

[whistlekiller2000]

Dec 30, 2019 9:35:29 GMT countryman said:

A fascinating film that brought back memories. A couple of things stand out t me. I used the Central line in the late 560s to go to school. I remember the seat velour to be red on the 62 stock on the Central; were they blue on the 59 stock on the Piccadilly?

I definitely remember the same thing.

[Tom]

Moquettes were certainly different between 1959 and 1962 stocks - plus as 59s went to the Northern line from the Picc they recieved new (Straub) moquette.

I'm intrigued by some of the footage which certainly looks like Aldwych - though they appear to be driving the train right into the overrun tunnel for filming purposes. (Pre-Moorgate so not really out of the ordinary, but I'm not sure I'd have liked to do it.)

[superteacher]

Dec 30, 2019 18:52:03 GMT Tom said:

Moquettes were certainly different between 1959 and 1962 stocks - plus as 59s went to the Northern line from the Picc they recieved new (Straub) moquette.

I'm intrigued by some of the footage which certainly looks like Aldwych - though they appear to be driving the train right into the overrun tunnel for filming purposes. (Pre-Moorgate so not really out of the ordinary, but I'm not sure I'd have liked to do it.)

The 59 stock, I believe, retained its original blue moquette until the early 90s. The 62 stock, if I recall, only ever had one moquette style throughout its life.

[Dstock7080]

Dec 30, 2019 22:26:26 GMT superteacher said:

Dec 30, 2019 18:52:03 GMT Tom said:

Moquettes were certainly different between 1959 and 1962 stocks - plus as 59s went to the Northern line from the Picc they recieved new (Straub) moquette.

The 59 stock, I believe, retained its original blue moquette until the early 90s. The 62 stock, if I recall, only ever had one moquette style throughout its life.

As Tom says when introduced the ‘59 Stock had a similar pattern moquette to the later ‘62 Stock grey/black/red, the blue/green/black (Straub) was introduced just before they were transferred to the Northern Line.

[revupminster]

This was covered in thread LU Film November 2019. Perhaps they should be merged.


duly done!

[Tom]

Dec 30, 2019 23:31:14 GMT Dstock7080 said:

As Tom says when introduced the ‘59 Stock had a similar pattern moquette to the later ‘62 Stock grey/black/red, the blue/green/black (Straub) was introduced just before they were transferred to the Northern Line.

You can see the moquette originally used on 1959 stock when running on the Piccadilly line in All That Mighty Heart.

[countryman]

After viewing the video of Last Train to Redbridge, I was overcome by a wave of nostalgia. I found the whole set of 28 episodes available on DVD, and luckily Father Christmas was listening, and the set turned up on Christmas day. I was watching the Last Train to Redbridge episode today, and I was surprise to recognise some of the scenes from the 1960, 1970s video above. It would appear that the 60's, 70's video may have been filmed for Department S episode, although not all of the footage was used. For instance, the shot of the train arriving at the depot at the start of the 60s video shows an 8 car train arriving, then pans to give a view of the depot. In the department S video, the same train arrives, but you only see the first 2 cars, then later you see the end of the shot,

Again of minor interest, the footage at Aldwych is of car 1751, the highest number 62 stock DM, the train entering the depot is headed by 1400, the lowest number 62 stock DM.