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Post by Deleted on May 5, 2006 8:51:12 GMT
This weekend there is no there is no service between Hounslow Central and Northfields, because of engineering work which is T5 related.
This is very rare, as usually on this stretch of line, they usually suspend the service Northfields to Heathrow for engineering works.
So as a result, there is a rare opportunity this weekend for all the passionate track-enthusiasts (which there are a few here!) to check out the Hounslow Central crossover (No. 5 points), in passenger service. Usually this reversing move takes is scheduled late at night by an empty train as a rusty rail move.
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Post by agoodcuppa on May 5, 2006 9:33:08 GMT
Usually this reversing move takes is scheduled late at night by an empty train as a rusty rail move. Surely that would be in the opposite direction to an eastbound to westbound move?
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Post by Deleted on May 5, 2006 11:12:53 GMT
Nope, that move WB to EB is done using an empty train late at night, before running to Northfields Depot to stable.
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Post by agoodcuppa on May 5, 2006 13:45:52 GMT
Is it signalled as a passenger carrying move in either direction?
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Post by Deleted on May 5, 2006 14:45:16 GMT
Is it signalled as a passenger carrying move in either direction? Its signalled as a passenger carrying move WB to EB (coloured signals). There is no signal for you to do the move EB to WB though.
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Post by agoodcuppa on May 5, 2006 14:47:37 GMT
So I guess that who ever gets the job of supervising the reversals will be hoping for decent weather. ;D
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DWS
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Post by DWS on May 5, 2006 15:01:00 GMT
So I guess that who ever gets the job of supervising the reversals will be hoping for decent weather. ;D Yes a nice deck chair and cool soft drinks will be laid on for platform staff ;D
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Post by agoodcuppa on May 5, 2006 15:23:23 GMT
So I guess that who ever gets the job of supervising the reversals will be hoping for decent weather. ;D Yes a nice deck chair and cool soft drinks will be laid on for platform staff ;D It's the poor s()d doing the clipping and scotching I was thinking of.
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Post by Deleted on May 5, 2006 21:28:25 GMT
er , why would anyone be scotching and clipping ?
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Post by agoodcuppa on May 5, 2006 21:35:56 GMT
I understood from DWS's post that there's no signal for the move over the crossover allowing an eastbound train to go west.
Is my understanding incorrect?
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Post by Deleted on May 5, 2006 21:41:15 GMT
trains will come into the westbound platform at hounslow central, the driver will announce all change, he will then change ends and wait for the stick to go east, your point about allowing an eastbound train to go west completley baffles me
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Post by agoodcuppa on May 5, 2006 21:47:41 GMT
But according to soultrain's original post the service is suspended between Northfields and Hounslow Central.
If that's so, how does a train get in to the westbound platform and return east?
The way I read the OP was that there was a service east of Northfields and west of Hounslow Central requiring trains to reverse eastbound to westbound at Hounslow Central.
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Post by agoodcuppa on May 5, 2006 21:51:41 GMT
It's OK, I've now read the note on the TfL web site all is explained. It's only suspended between Hounslow Central and Heathrow.
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Post by Deleted on May 5, 2006 21:54:58 GMT
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Post by agoodcuppa on May 5, 2006 22:00:45 GMT
suspended between hounslow central and the airport Hence the confusion if you read the OP.
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Post by Deleted on May 5, 2006 22:03:13 GMT
even if there WAS a facility to reverse east to west at houn cen , the train would have had to have come from the airport in order to reverse there in the first place , but there are no trains at all coming from the airport this weeknd because there arent any trains going TO the airport this weekend ;D ;D ;D
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Post by Deleted on May 5, 2006 22:05:18 GMT
but yes indeed i do see your point about the original post ,
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Post by agoodcuppa on May 5, 2006 22:06:00 GMT
Guess who's not getting a job writing up passenger information boards? ;D
(Clue, see first post in this thread.)
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Post by Deleted on May 5, 2006 22:10:01 GMT
LMAO
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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2006 8:19:47 GMT
And here I was thinking I had written Hounslow Central - Heathrow; instead I write Hounslow - Northfields by accident. My error but that still does qualify me fior writing passenger boards
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Post by Tomcakes on May 6, 2006 12:17:55 GMT
Presumably some services will be turning back at Northfields or going to Rayners Lane? As I doubt the whole service could be reversed at Houns Central!
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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2006 14:08:34 GMT
Presumably some services will be turning back at Northfields or going to Rayners Lane? As I doubt the whole service could be reversed at Houns Central! Yeah thats right. In fact its only a 10 minute service to/from Hounslow Central. Then there is a mixture of Rayners Lane/Uxbridge and Northfields trains to provide an 18 TPH service through Central London (usually its 21 TPH through the weekends)
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Post by Deleted on May 7, 2006 19:39:07 GMT
I went by Hounslow Central today, as the train I was on was leaving, I noticed some guy on the edge of the platform taking a photo of the train passing the crossover - I wonder if that was anyone on here!
Does anyone know what the DMIs were displaying for Hounslow Central trains, I assume that they can't say Hounslow Central on there.
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Post by Deleted on May 7, 2006 20:32:05 GMT
Presumably some services will be turning back at Northfields or going to Rayners Lane? As I doubt the whole service could be reversed at Houns Central! Yeah thats right. In fact its only a 10 minute service to/from Hounslow Central. Then there is a mixture of Rayners Lane/Uxbridge and Northfields trains to provide an 18 TPH service through Central London (usually its 21 TPH through the weekends) Typical LU lack of efficiency! If stepping back was put in use, then I'm sure that the usual weekend 5 minute frequency would have been possible.
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Post by agoodcuppa on May 7, 2006 20:58:43 GMT
Typical LU lack of efficiency! If stepping back was put in use, then I'm sure that the usual weekend 5 minute frequency would have been possible. Would a five minute service to Hounslow Central be needed on a Sunday? Except possibly in the peak, I don't think it needs a five minute service at any time. I suggest such a service level would be excessive (leading to a waste of energy, traincrew and train mileage), and that bringing in a new method of working (for the Piccdilly Line) on a "one off" basis would lead to problems of it's own. Therefore the most efficient service pattern was implemented.
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Post by Deleted on May 7, 2006 22:07:58 GMT
Typical LU lack of efficiency! If stepping back was put in use, then I'm sure that the usual weekend 5 minute frequency would have been possible. I notice that the Picc line generally frown upon stepping back or reversing operators and try to avoid it as much as possible.
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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2006 17:02:32 GMT
Typical LU lack of efficiency! If stepping back was put in use, then I'm sure that the usual weekend 5 minute frequency would have been possible. Would a five minute service to Hounslow Central be needed on a Sunday? Except possibly in the peak, I don't think it needs a five minute service at any time. I suggest such a service level would be excessive (leading to a waste of energy, traincrew and train mileage), and that bringing in a new method of working (for the Piccdilly Line) on a "one off" basis would lead to problems of it's own. Therefore the most efficient service pattern was implemented. I think a 5 minute service (which is usually provided) to Heathrow is definately needed on the weekends, as the rear 4 carriages have very few seats left upon departure from Heathrow. Maybe that 5 minute frequency was not needed last weekend, as most Heathrow passengers were bussing it from Acton Town. However, this reduction in frequency should not have compromised the service through central London, which needs its off peak 21tph. Especially on a weekend where half of London was decending on central London to see a 40ft tall animatronic French Elephant.
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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2006 20:35:24 GMT
I think a 5 minute service (which is usually provided) to Heathrow is definately needed on the weekends, as the rear 4 carriages have very few seats left upon departure from Heathrow. Maybe that 5 minute frequency was not needed last weekend, as most Heathrow passengers were bussing it from Acton Town. However, this reduction in frequency should not have compromised the service through central London, which needs its off peak 21tph. Especially on a weekend where half of London was decending on central London to see a 40ft tall animatronic French Elephant. Just had a look at the timetable, and I can kind of see why there was a reduction in the trunk area. The pattern of service gave all WB trains a 1.5, 2 or 2.5 minute stand at Acton Town, deliberately done for the expected higher number of passengers with luggage and the associated dwell times, since they would all be told to use the bus from Acton Town to Heathrow. I don't think with those kind of additional dwell time, that you can still run 21 tph service OK without higher than usual congestion and blocking back around Acton Town. So I guess it was a case of being slightly less efficient in this case, in order to provide a more robust timetable.
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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2006 22:21:21 GMT
I think a 5 minute service (which is usually provided) to Heathrow is definately needed on the weekends, as the rear 4 carriages have very few seats left upon departure from Heathrow. Maybe that 5 minute frequency was not needed last weekend, as most Heathrow passengers were bussing it from Acton Town. However, this reduction in frequency should not have compromised the service through central London, which needs its off peak 21tph. Especially on a weekend where half of London was decending on central London to see a 40ft tall animatronic French Elephant. Just had a look at the timetable, and I can kind of see why there was a reduction in the trunk area. The pattern of service gave all WB trains a 1.5, 2 or 2.5 minute stand at Acton Town, deliberately done for the expected higher number of passengers with luggage and the associated dwell times, since they would all be told to use the bus from Acton Town to Heathrow. I don't think with those kind of additional dwell time, that you can still run 21 tph service OK without higher than usual congestion and blocking back around Acton Town. So I guess it was a case of being slightly less efficient in this case, in order to provide a more robust timetable. OK, I can see some of the reasoning for the reduced service last weekend. But how does this 1.5-2.5minute dwell time compare with permitted dwell times at other through stations where passengers have heavy baggage such as T4, or at present Hatton X? I still think that dwell times of over 1.5mins are a bit excessive!
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Post by agoodcuppa on May 9, 2006 8:41:13 GMT
I still think that dwell times of over 1.5mins are a bit excessive! Not when detraining a full trainload of passengers, many of whom are carrying luggage. Don't forget also they will need time to get clear of the platform, having two trainloads of people on the platform and access areas would make it difficuly for emergency access and could cause problems. There is also the question of how quickly passengers can be transferred to buses and be got clear of the area. A contributing factor to that aspect is how much standage is there for the buses. There's a lot more considerations than simply pumping trains through a given area, they don't operate in isolation and more is not always best.
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