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Post by Deleted on May 16, 2016 17:03:15 GMT
Well Claire Perry (Under Secretary of State for Transport) said in a speech at the opening ceremony for Lea Bridge Station this morning that the service level at Lea Bridge would increase to 4 trains per hour when a new link opens in 2018.
I don't know what this new link is that she is referring to.
I am not sure if she has let 'something out of the bag'.
You can hear what she says about 3 mins into the YouTube clip below.
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Post by Deleted on May 16, 2016 17:05:19 GMT
Hi there I am new to this forum, so please bear with me. Does anyone have any update on work to 3/4 track part of the Lea Valley Line, to the North of Lea Bridge station. I keep looking for info about the STAR project but can hardly find anything on the web. Is it definitely going ahead and does it have a likely completion date. Lea Bridge station reopening is a completely separate thing to the STAR project (though there is obviously some synergy between the two), because it could be served to the existing Stratford terminators and required no significant infrastructure works away from the station itself. The proposed 3 / 4 tracking plan starts at Tottenham Hale - quite some distance away from Lea Bridge station and after the line from Clapton has joined the line from Stratford. At the moment it is still just a proposal though - IIRC the final details / financing / of the scheme have yet to be finalised, so it will be some time before workers will appear on the ground. Thus you are realistically looking at somewhere around 2020ish at the earliest before it could be up and running. The West Anglia section here shows project plans and timetable as at Jan 2016: www.networkrail.co.uk/enhancements-delivery-plan-update.pdf. |
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Post by Jerome H on May 16, 2016 17:47:13 GMT
This is my video contribution. Both trains have Anglia branding, but have different coloured doors. Why is this? Red is a Greater Anglia refurbished train, navy carries the old National Express branding and presumably is awaiting refurbishment |
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Post by Chris M on May 16, 2016 23:18:24 GMT
I suspect that only one has been reliveried since Abellio took over from National Express.
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Post by snoggle on May 17, 2016 0:08:22 GMT
Hi there I am new to this forum, so please bear with me. Does anyone have any update on work to 3/4 track part of the Lea Valley Line, to the North of Lea Bridge station. I keep looking for info about the STAR project but can hardly find anything on the web. Is it definitely going ahead and does it have a likely completion date. Lea Bridge station reopening is a completely separate thing to the STAR project (though there is obviously some synergy between the two), because it could be served to the existing Stratford terminators and required no significant infrastructure works away from the station itself. The proposed 3 / 4 tracking plan starts at Tottenham Hale - quite some distance away from Lea Bridge station and after the line from Clapton has joined the line from Stratford. At the moment it is still just a proposal though - IIRC the final details / financing / of the scheme have yet to be finalised, so it will be some time before workers will appear on the ground. Thus you are realistically looking at somewhere around 2020ish at the earliest before it could be up and running. Not quite correct. Network Rail have had people on site in various places for months. For example all the trees were cut down beside the Ferry Lane estate months ago. Last week I noticed that site huts and a welfare van (toilets etc) had appeared. Some other clearance work has also been ongoing for a while. Network Rail have to start moving signalling cabinets and cable troughts that will be in the way of the track bed. The basic funding structure was in place a while ago and monies were released to Network Rail to allow them to proceed with advance works as above and to support the progression of the GRIP work. The massive "fly in the ointment" was the issue over train service levels for STAR and the way in which DfT set out an "add on" to the Greater Anglia franchise spec which did not guarantee a regular 4 tph service. This is a pre-requisite for the delivery of housing at Meridian Water and it has to be there by a given date in 2018. Enfield Council took the DfT to court over the franchise tph issue and lost. Quite what has happened since is not in the public domain but every month that passes without a resolution makes it harder for the 2018 STAR service deadline to be met and that imperils the housing deal and then the whole thing unravels because the private sector funding isn't there. We can't be very far away from the point at which it all becomes impossible to deliver. The Mayoral sub committee that was handling this project disappeared from view due to purdah so there are no meeting notes for the last few months. The fact that the new Mayor has not appointed any of his team of Deputy Mayors nor set out his preferred governance structure nor a transition path from old to new doesn't help matters. Restructuring all this stuff and making sure you don't lose knowledge or momentum are crucially important. As for the track layout then it is simply a single track added alongside the existing 2 track railway with space left for a 4th track to be added later. The one aspect that is unclear is what the layout at T Hale will be - will there be an extra 2 tracks there with 2 new platform faces so STAR trains can pass? The fact that the LU station rebuild hasn't started on site suggests to me that someone, somewhere is still working out what the NR platform layout will be or amended planning permission is going to be needed. Oh and don't forget Crossrail2 that could cause another rebuild at some point! |
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Post by stapler on May 17, 2016 7:07:33 GMT
The extra track is to start at Coppermill Junction, not Tottenham Hale, isn't it?
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Post by snoggle on May 17, 2016 12:37:52 GMT
The extra track is to start at Coppermill Junction, not Tottenham Hale, isn't it? AIUI yes it would. That would allow the separate STAR shuttles to not get in the way of the WAML services. My only query is whether there are two STAR tracks at T Hale. I believe the Ferry Lane bridge is a constraint but it may be possible to have a junction under there to give 2 tracks in the station area itself. If the new platforms are built to 8 car length then they might end up slightly further north than the existing ones so trains don't foul the platform edges if there were to be a junction (1 track to 2 tracks) under Ferry Lane bridge (my speculation here not a reference to any outline track layout). |
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Post by stapler on May 18, 2016 21:31:53 GMT
As I remember it, there were actually four tracks north from Coppermill Junction, and some extra as goods loops between there and Tottenham South Junction. But I don't remember any more than two under Ferry Lane bridge and through the station, though there were extra lines to the east of the platforms "round the back", perhaps as many as four. Perhaps someone who knows the area better could confirm or otherwise? A lot of the freight infrastructure in the LV was disused/disconnected about the time of electrification - mi to late 60s?
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Post by John Tuthill on May 18, 2016 21:54:38 GMT
As I remember it, there were actually four tracks north from Coppermill Junction, and some extra as goods loops between there and Tottenham South Junction. But I don't remember any more than two under Ferry Lane bridge and through the station, though there were extra lines to the east of the platforms "round the back", perhaps as many as four. Perhaps someone who knows the area better could confirm or otherwise? A lot of the freight infrastructure in the LV was disused/disconnected about the time of electrification - mi to late 60s? Check out the 'Disused Stations' web site |
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Post by superteacher on May 21, 2016 20:10:16 GMT
Went through Lea Bridge today and saw a healthy number of people using it.
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Post by snoggle on May 24, 2016 14:24:49 GMT
Enfield Council have lost their appeal against the decision that the DfT acted rationally in not ensuring 4 tph would serve the new Meridian Water service. (info courtesy of London Reconnections blog) Appeal JudgementI wonder where this leaves things? |
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Post by stapler on May 24, 2016 17:32:33 GMT
Thank you.
Poor old Enfield do not seem to be doing very well.
I see the learned judge states that 3 tracks are to be provided between **Stratford** and Angel Rd (etc). Is that true?
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Dom K
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Post by Dom K on May 25, 2016 8:36:39 GMT
The station was well used on my train towards Stratford just now! People getting on and off and on the northbound platform to Tottenham Hale. Makes you wonder what the people did before the station opened! I believe Angel a Road and Northumberland Park would both see more passengers if there was a regular service
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Post by melikepie on May 25, 2016 13:12:12 GMT
There is a regular service at Northumberland Park, just hourly though.
And I know that the last part was rhetorical but I think I can explain the situation at least partly. The nearest station to here is Clapton, which is essentially on the Chingford branch with very few direct services to Tottenham Hale and the North.
Lea Bridge has better links in a way to other parts of London through Tottenham Hale and Stratford as well as Norfolk, Cambs, Essex, Suffolk and Herts. Combine that with easier access to Hackney Marshes, 2 leisure centres, a campsite, riding school, the Lea navigation etc, two nature reserves and a supermarket as well as the initial hike in passengers due to something new opening means it is understandable why it is busy.
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Post by phil on May 25, 2016 15:47:06 GMT
The station was well used on my train towards Stratford just now! People getting on and off and on the northbound platform to Tottenham Hale. Makes you wonder what the people did before the station opened! I believe Angel a Road and Northumberland Park would both see more passengers if there was a regular service Nobody disputes that - but making everyone from the likes of Harlow, Cambridge and Stansted suffer for the sake of a small part of London is not acceptable either. In many ways the WAML through the Lea valley is a textbook example of why a frequent stopping service is incompatible with a double track railway also serving areas well beyond London (e.g. why routing say, Arun Valley services via Sutton, Epsom & Dorking is not a good idea). Everybody realises that the key to improving local service provision in the Lea Valley are new dedicated tracks for local stoppers - until that happens (and ALL stoppers are removed from the tracks used for longer distance services) you will never be able to achieve the step change in service political bodies and residents of the area are calling for. |
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Post by Dom K on May 25, 2016 15:57:27 GMT
The station was well used on my train towards Stratford just now! People getting on and off and on the northbound platform to Tottenham Hale. Makes you wonder what the people did before the station opened! I believe Angel a Road and Northumberland Park would both see more passengers if there was a regular service Nobody disputes that - but making everyone from the likes of Harlow, Cambridge and Stansted suffer for the sake of a small part of London is not acceptable either. In many ways the WAML through the Lea valley is a textbook example of why a frequent stopping service is incompatible with a double track railway also serving areas well beyond London (e.g. why routing say, Arun Valley services via Sutton, Epsom & Dorking is not a good idea). Everybody realises that the key to improving local service provision in the Lea Valley are new dedicated tracks for local stoppers - until that happens (and ALL stoppers are removed from the tracks used for longer distance services) you will never be able to achieve the step change in service political bodies and residents of the area are calling for. I never suggested a more regular service in its current situation. I merely speculated what an increase in service would create. It is obvious that the key to this is additional tracks and the 3rd track from Angel Road to Coppermill Junction will in part go towards solving this. We will only see 4 tracks when CR2 gets done, whenever that will happen I'm unsure Anyway back on topic, this is for STAR and Lea Bridge updates. |
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Post by superteacher on May 25, 2016 18:37:21 GMT
The station was well used on my train towards Stratford just now! People getting on and off and on the northbound platform to Tottenham Hale. Makes you wonder what the people did before the station opened! I believe Angel a Road and Northumberland Park would both see more passengers if there was a regular service Nobody disputes that - but making everyone from the likes of Harlow, Cambridge and Stansted suffer for the sake of a small part of London is not acceptable either. In many ways the WAML through the Lea valley is a textbook example of why a frequent stopping service is incompatible with a double track railway also serving areas well beyond London (e.g. why routing say, Arun Valley services via Sutton, Epsom & Dorking is not a good idea). Everybody realises that the key to improving local service provision in the Lea Valley are new dedicated tracks for local stoppers - until that happens (and ALL stoppers are removed from the tracks used for longer distance services) you will never be able to achieve the step change in service political bodies and residents of the area are calling for. Stratford is a major transport hub and destination in its own right. And has links to Docklands. So it's hardly "a small part of Londom". |
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Post by castlebar on May 25, 2016 19:08:59 GMT
Please do not bring the Arun Valley route into this. I live on that route and many people who live here would love a service via Dorking that avoids the Gatwick bottleneck. Bringing Arun Valley services into this is completely "off piste", or, I will argue that you are wrong
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Post by phil on May 27, 2016 18:01:40 GMT
Please do not bring the Arun Valley route into this. I live on that route and many people who live here would love a service via Dorking that avoids the Gatwick bottleneck. Bringing Arun Valley services into this is completely "off piste", or, I will argue that you are wrong It is indeed 'off piste' / 'off topic' to discuss the Arun valley here and that was not my intention as such - but within the London area the fundamental issue is the same as the Lea Valley, namely the route via Dorking has only 2 tracks and very few passing places once it gets busy. In the case of the line through Sutton Epsom and Dorking however its long distance trains that lose out - getting stuck behind the frequent all station stoppers with no way of getting past them while in the Lea valley its the reverse way round (stoppers cannot be run frequently as they hold up long distance stuff). Diversion onto a 4 track railway with dedicated 'slow' (all station stoppers) and 'fast' (long distance) services for both the Lea Valley and Arun Valley services is thus beneficial for both sets of travellers as it allows more trains to run. Simples as a Meerecat would say. [Note the real problem with the BML, and potentially the Lea valley if the designers are not careful, is conflicts at the remaining flat junctions or a lack of platforms at stations where all services call. As E Croydon shows, both these factors actually prevent quadruple track main lines (with service group separation) from achieving their full potential]. |
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Post by Chris M on May 27, 2016 19:05:23 GMT
Platforms can be a tricky one long term, as what might seem an insignificant little hamlet today could in future be somewhere that needs as many trains as possible to shift the crowds. The obvious solution is to build platforms on all lines, even if those on the fast tracks rarely get used - but this "just in case" thinking for times of disruption and future proofing (often not even passive provision) doesn't find favour with beancounters.
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Post by stapler on May 28, 2016 7:08:39 GMT
The Lea Valley Line situation is worsened by joining the Chingford line (4TPH)at Clapton Junction for the 2-track section through the Clapton tunnels, which it would be impossible to quadruple, and by the flat junctions at Stratford if you choose that way. You also can't divert 2 Chingfords via Stratford as the link was removed in 1967; although powers to re-lay it were obtained in 1982, nothing was ever done....
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Post by superteacher on Jun 7, 2016 19:52:36 GMT
The Lea Valley Line situation is worsened by joining the Chingford line (4TPH)at Clapton Junction for the 2-track section through the Clapton tunnels, which it would be impossible to quadruple, and by the flat junctions at Stratford if you choose that way. You also can't divert 2 Chingfords via Stratford as the link was removed in 1967; although powers to re-lay it were obtained in 1982, nothing was ever done.... Surely it wouldn't be a major engineering issue to reinstate the curve? |
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Post by stapler on Jun 7, 2016 21:43:01 GMT
ST, you would not think so! But I have seen absurd costs quoted for the work.........
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Post by superteacher on Jun 7, 2016 21:59:56 GMT
ST, you would not think so! But I have seen absurd costs quoted for the work......... Bit like when they wanted to close railways. They would quote silly prices to renew bridges etc, just to strengthen the often weak proposals for closure. |
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Post by stapler on Jun 8, 2016 7:18:39 GMT
That line has a history. The GER built it on the quick, on the cheap, without Parliamentary authority, to open the Walthamstow branch in April 1870. Its closure was to avoid disturbing the LV resignalling. Very shortsighted.....and now tens of millions to reopen it!
The cost was estimated in 2009 as £25 million. Pretty absurd for half a mile of [probably] single line.
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Post by Dom K on Jul 21, 2016 8:34:10 GMT
THere is some ground works with a digger on the southbound side between Tottenham Hale and Coppermill Junction.
About 12 people got off at Lea Bridge on the 929 Tottenham Hale- Stratford
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Post by snoggle on Jul 26, 2016 18:56:06 GMT
Looks like a final funding package has been put together for STAR. TfL are to take over the sponsorship of the project from the GLA. NR remain responsible for design, delivery and technical assurance activities. Completion scheduled for Dec 2018. From a new paper to the TfL Finance and Policy Cttee. content.tfl.gov.uk/fpc-160727-item11-star-p1.pdf |
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Post by Dom K on Aug 10, 2016 8:35:53 GMT
Significant work has started between Angel Road and Coppermill Junction with the main works just north of Northumberland Park and south of Tottenham Hale Stations. Works include removal of trees and shrubs and laying a gravel track.
Work has also begun at Tottenham Hale Station with the customer car park closed and used for work persons and equipment. There is also tons of markings sprayed onto the pathway around the entrance of Tottenham Hale and surrounding area up to the bus station
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Post by Dom K on Aug 10, 2016 8:37:36 GMT
I've modified the thread title to better reflect current news and that Lea Bridge has now been finished
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Post by snoggle on Aug 10, 2016 10:29:06 GMT
Abellio have won the new Greater Anglia franchise. www.gov.uk/government/news/better-journeys-for-rail-passengers-and-boost-for-derby-train-industry-as-new-east-anglia-franchise-announcedIn very broad terms there will be large scale fleet replacement with new electric and bi-mode trains from Bombardier and Stadler. Service levels will be increased on a number of main routes including London Norwich, London - Southend and on West Anglia. A 2 tph STAR service is confirmed [1]. However what is not confirmed is what level of service will be provided at local London area stations on the WAML. The apparent increase in services to Hertford East and to Bishops Stortford / Cambridge do not bode well for a consistent 4 tph being offered from Angel Road and Northumberland Park - unfortunately  . The only possible hope is if the new stock has superior performance allowing a modest improvement in track capacity. [1] select "West Anglia" in the drop menu on this Map page of franchise benefits |
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. The only possible hope is if the new stock has superior performance allowing a modest improvement in track capacity.
