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Post by PiccNT on Apr 16, 2017 15:58:54 GMT
<<rincew1nd>> Originally posted in this thread, here's a quote for context:
Looks to me as tho brighter bulbs have been fitted They've probably just cleaned out the dust/condensation in the diffusers Talking of lights, and going off topic slightly, the signal bulbs between Manor House and Turnpike Lane EB have all been replaced with LED's. They are so bright you almost need sunglasses along that section.
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rincew1nd
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Post by rincew1nd on Apr 16, 2017 16:43:35 GMT
Bulbs? You mean lamps surely‽ Bulbs go in the ground and produce the wonderful displays of snowdrops in my front garden!
I've moved this into a thread of its own in the signalling section.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2017 17:23:00 GMT
<<rincew1nd>> Originally posted in this thread, here's a quote for context:
They've probably just cleaned out the dust/condensation in the diffusers Talking of lights, and going off topic slightly, the signal bulbs between Manor House and Turnpike Lane EB have all been replaced with LED's. They are so bright you almost need sunglasses along that section. There's more then that on the Picc you sure you been looking correctly |
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rincew1nd
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Post by rincew1nd on Apr 16, 2017 17:30:18 GMT
Do these new head look like the ones they are replacing? I've seen some single aspect ones on Network Rail that look simply horrible, almost like they belong in the window of a take-away:  It's possible to do single aspect and still look nice:  or  If the new heads are much brighter, does it remove the need for Fog Repeaters? |
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Post by PiccNT on Apr 16, 2017 18:09:14 GMT
<<rincew1nd>> Originally posted in this thread, here's a quote for context:
<</rincew1nd>>Talking of lights, and going off topic slightly, the signal bulbs between Manor House and Turnpike Lane EB have all been replaced with LED's. They are so bright you almost need sunglasses along that section. There's more then that on the Picc you sure you been looking correctly In the open sections maybe but these are the only ones, to my knowledge, in tunnel sections. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2017 19:34:10 GMT
Well I know they are in the tunnel section from Earls Court to Barons Court on both roads
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2017 19:35:43 GMT
Do these new head look like the ones they are replacing? I've seen some single aspect ones on Network Rail that look simply horrible, almost like they belong in the window of a take-away: It's possible to do single aspect and still look nice: or If the new heads are much brighter, does it remove the need for Fog Repeaters? These are not installed on LU |
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rincew1nd
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Post by rincew1nd on Apr 16, 2017 19:38:54 GMT
Do these new head look like the ones they are replacing? I've seen some single aspect ones on Network Rail that look simply horrible, almost like they belong in the window of a take-away: [See above for pictures of what I mean] These are not installed on LU Glad to hear it! So are LU's LED signals completely new signal heads like is happening on Network Rail, or are they an LED lamp fitted into the existing signals? |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2017 19:47:30 GMT
LED lamp unit / Light Engines are installed in LU signals but not everywhere yet especially outside and I don't think they will on SSL due to the upgrade coming not worth the resource to convert them
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Post by rincew1nd on Apr 16, 2017 20:05:57 GMT
LED lamp unit / Light Engines are installed in LU signals... Good to hear that the look of the signals will stay the same, it's part of the 'feel' of the place. I'm loving that there is such a thing as a "light engine", I'm imagining some victorian contraption but suspect it's actually just a bit of silicon. |
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cso
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Post by cso on Apr 16, 2017 20:31:08 GMT
I'm just hoping LU have bought decent LEDs for the signals, or they could end up rather more expensive than normal light bulbs if they need to be replaced... and I'd also guess that depending on how signalling and fault detection works could probably also require a change to that, not just the head.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2017 20:48:48 GMT
Well they have been in since approx 2006 they are not new
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Post by PiccNT on Apr 16, 2017 21:35:30 GMT
Well I know they are in the tunnel section from Earls Court to Barons Court on both roads Well maybe so but the newly installed "lamps" are brighter than the sun :-) |
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Post by MoreToJack on Apr 16, 2017 21:53:16 GMT
Not sure why the use of quotation marks around lamps. That is their correct name, as already pointed out by rincew1nd. |
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Post by fish7373 on Apr 17, 2017 1:57:34 GMT
Hi i have a repeater signal from the northern line in my office an old one. and is fitted with LEDs lamps green LEDs and yellow LEDs.
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Post by nig on Apr 17, 2017 6:10:28 GMT
Well I know they are in the tunnel section from Earls Court to Barons Court on both roads Well maybe so but the newly installed "lamps" are brighter than the sun :-) Didn't they take all the led ones out last year as they kept causing Signal failures the ones on manor house east bound are a trial for new ones |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 17, 2017 9:35:46 GMT
There was a bad batch but we use the same type as Tubelines as installed on the Picc when they do fail they do fail 9 out of 10 times short circuit so this will blow the feed fuse which can cause other issues.
If they are too bright this is for yourself to take up with the members of the sighting committee which will address these issues with the maintainer / asset owner
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Post by Jerome H on Apr 17, 2017 10:57:30 GMT
There was a bad batch but we use the same type as Tubelines as installed on the Picc when they do fail they do fail 9 out of 10 times short circuit so this will blow the feed fuse which can cause other issues. If they are too bright this is for yourself to take up with the members of the sighting committee which will address these issues with the maintainer / asset owner Not train related, but LEDs being installed that were too bright reminds me of an office project I was working on where all of the ceiling lights were replaced with LEDs. A couple of employees were so unhappy with the over-brightness that within a month they came through and redid all of the lights. Is the "sighting committee" a real entity or have I missed a tounge in cheek comment |
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rincew1nd
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Post by rincew1nd on Apr 17, 2017 11:01:25 GMT
Signal sighting committees exist to ensure signals can be appropriately, well, sighted!
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Post by North End on Apr 17, 2017 11:07:40 GMT
There was a bad batch but we use the same type as Tubelines as installed on the Picc when they do fail they do fail 9 out of 10 times short circuit so this will blow the feed fuse which can cause other issues. If they are too bright this is for yourself to take up with the members of the sighting committee which will address these issues with the maintainer / asset owner Not train related, but LEDs being installed that were too bright reminds me of an office project I was working on where all of the ceiling lights were replaced with LEDs. A couple of employees were so unhappy with the over-brightness that within a month they came through and redid all of the lights. Is the "sighting committee" a real entity or have I missed a tounge in cheek comment It's real. A group of stakeholders (end users, engineers and managers) will view a signal and check its sighting meets specifications and is as optimum as can be achieved at the location in question. Normally occurs for new works but also after SPADs if sighting is cited as a contributory factor. |
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Post by North End on Apr 17, 2017 11:13:19 GMT
There was a bad batch but we use the same type as Tubelines as installed on the Picc when they do fail they do fail 9 out of 10 times short circuit so this will blow the feed fuse which can cause other issues. If they are too bright this is for yourself to take up with the members of the sighting committee which will address these issues with the maintainer / asset owner Not train related, but LEDs being installed that were too bright reminds me of an office project I was working on where all of the ceiling lights were replaced with LEDs. A couple of employees were so unhappy with the over-brightness that within a month they came through and redid all of the lights. Is the "sighting committee" a real entity or have I missed a tounge in cheek comment On a related note, I noticed a load of different designs of LED tunnel lights have appeared in Charing Cross sidings on the Jubilee. Since virtually every fitting is different one presumes this is all experimental. Most of them are harshly bright and not easy on the eye, given that drivers often find the existing tunnel lights irritating when illuminated I don't think anything brighter will be well received. Personally I don't think brighter tunnel lights are needed, the main benefit of LED would be reduced energy consumption and fewer blown lamps. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 17, 2017 12:24:50 GMT
Signal sighting committees exist to ensure signals can be appropriately, well, sighted! And the brightness |
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Post by brigham on Apr 18, 2017 7:55:57 GMT
These signals aren't 'single aspect', surely?
A 'single aspect' signal is something like a fixed distant, capable of only one indication.
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Post by shunterl44 on Apr 18, 2017 9:44:56 GMT
Using a combination of red and green LEDs in what looks like a single aspect head allows three aspects to be shown to the driver as red and green together produce yellow. NR have installed many of these around their network.
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Post by brigham on Apr 18, 2017 11:52:04 GMT
Using a combination of red and green LEDs in what looks like a single aspect head allows three aspects to be shown to the driver as red and green together produce yellow. NR have installed many of these around their network. Such single-lens signals were familiar around Darlington and Northallerton until the 'seventies at least. They were proposed as a contributary factor to the 'Sparshatt incident', at the latter location; a suggestion roundly dismissed. I wonder if any of these LNER-type are still in situ? |
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Post by fish7373 on Apr 24, 2017 22:46:39 GMT
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Post by norbitonflyer on Apr 25, 2017 7:05:17 GMT
Using a combination of red and green LEDs in what looks like a single aspect head allows three aspects to be shown to the driver as red and green together produce yellow. This sounds a good recipe for "wrong side" failures. If the red LEDs fail a "caution" aspect would appear to be "all clear" |
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Post by brigham on Apr 25, 2017 7:43:28 GMT
I would imagine that the yellow aspect isn't given by simply leaving the normal red and green LEDs lit together. Can anyone confirm?
The origin of yellow as 'caution' is thought to come from the US, where showing both red AND green together was the 'caution' signal. From a distance, this appeared yellow.
I've never seen any contemporary evidence for how this was achieved. Presumably, the spectacles were large, and the lamp showed through both glasses in the 45-degree position of the arm.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 25, 2017 8:33:28 GMT
There is 2 more types of LED's which are used |
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Post by trt on Apr 25, 2017 9:22:05 GMT
Are those lamps a standard fit base? So that you could inadvertently insert a green lamp in a red socket?
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LEDs for Signal heads FISH7373 NFP 81C
