Easter Met Line Closures

[Deleted]

Another great Bank Holiday for people living north of Wembley Park wishing to go to North Harrow,Pinner,Northwood Hills,or Northwood.
You wanna travel?Go away.
This weekend 7th/8th March doesn't look much better.
I take it these closures are still on.

[mrfs42]

I don't get it. Would you rather these engineering works were done mid-week?

[maxtube]

Ha ha, so much for the MetroLand posters from 70 years ago: A fast and frequent train service every day to Wembley, Chorley Wood, Rickmansworth... Liar.

[Deleted]

No I wouldn't want these works during the week,but first we wouldn't need these if upgrades had been done years ago,in a timely manner like the metro systems in other European cities.
In this current situation then,when will it end? Or are we doomed for years of disruption?

[citysig]

If they were done years ago, or left for another 5 years, the shutdowns would be more or less the same.

For a start, if there were no shutdowns, then no additional crossovers could be installed, so that shutdowns were less severe / widespread.

It is because we do not have crossovers and sidings at every single station that we have to shut large chunks of line down. Our workforce and the trains serving the worksite have to be protected and have to be able to work efficiently.

I'm sure that if you were to carry out some sort of home improvement, then there would be disruption to your daily life. There would be areas you could not ordinarily live in whilst the work is carried out. But once it's done, you enjoy the results.

The alternative, is not do the works at all, and then you will see years of disruption.

[Ben]

Are any extra crossovers being installed to protect against future disruption though?

[citysig]

No. Any crossover would require a weekend (or more) to be installed and cost probably as much as the current track replacements. You would effectively "waste" a weekend (or more) for the sake of a crossover that would probably end up being only useful for that particular set of engineering works.

[peanuts]

Mar 5, 2009 14:24:35 GMT @landau1945 said:

No I wouldn't want these works during the week,but first we wouldn't need these if upgrades had been done years ago,in a timely manner like the metro systems in other European cities.
In this current situation then,when will it end? Or are we doomed for years of disruption?

Not quite sure i understand your argument there. Surely that's a chicken and egg scenario.

The upgrades are being carried out in order to introduce a new signalling system for the new rolling stock - so that efficiency on your journey is improved. They are being carried out in a timely manner - i.e. not during peak weekday periods, and before the introduction of the new S-Stock.

....surely something that will benefit us all once completed.

[Deleted]

Mar 5, 2009 12:05:13 GMT @landau1945 said:

Another great Bank Holiday for people living north of Wembley Park wishing to go to North Harrow,Pinner,Northwood Hills,or Northwood.
You wanna travel?Go away.
This weekend 7th/8th March doesn't look much better.
I take it these closures are still on.

I know you have heard this time and time again, but this is fact, since the early 80's with Thatcher, the Underground, including British Rail suffered massive under-funding. This also happened with early Blair, under-funding, we are now catching up. This sort of spending needs to be done, and is being done.

[Ben]

Well its good that it is being done, but the chance should be taken to include extra flexibility so when, in however many years, this happens all over again, more options are available.

[Colin]

Installing more crossovers?

For starters, that would cost a damm sight more than simple plain line track - is the expense (and were are talking many thousands here) worth it just for something that may only used once in a blue moon?

Then you have to maintain that asset - more wasted money.

And if that wasn't bad enough, should any part of it fail, you would have even more delays whilst correct procedures are applied to run a service through the area.

Whilst the idea would be nice in an ideal world, it's not practical on an operational railway like LU's.

[metman]

I think the Met main has quite a flexible layout already. Trains can be reversed at Chalfont, Ricky, Northwood, Hillingdon, Ruislip, Rayners Lane, Harrow and Wembley Park! There are others in the covered way! Maybe Pinner would be a nice option, but as Colin says, its about cost/benefit.

[neasdena60]

Mar 5, 2009 14:00:41 GMT mrfs42 said:

I don't get it. Would you rather these engineering works were done mid-week?

it never ends north of northwood, everyone is fed up.

[Deleted]

Mar 6, 2009 9:10:36 GMT @neasdena60 said:

Mar 5, 2009 14:00:41 GMT mrfs42 said:

I don't get it. Would you rather these engineering works were done mid-week?

it never ends north of northwood, everyone is fed up.

Yep it probably is bad for the punters north of Northwood, they must be quite used to getting on a bus now. When the Uxbridge branch is closed I just drive to work.

[mcmaddog]

Mar 5, 2009 14:00:41 GMT mrfs42 said:

I don't get it. Would you rather these engineering works were done mid-week?

Yes, Network Rail style 2 week blockade. People can plan their holidays around it / plan consistent other routes.
Weekends on the Met now are just miserable

[Deleted]

Mar 6, 2009 8:16:48 GMT metman said:

I think the Met main has quite a flexible layout already. Trains can be reversed at Chalfont, Ricky, Northwood, Hillingdon, Ruislip, Rayners Lane, Harrow and Wembley Park! There are others in the covered way! Maybe Pinner would be a nice option, but as Colin says, its about cost/benefit.

Pinner, hmmmm.... alot of work going on at Pinner, flattening the ground and large ballast sacks at one end.

[glasgowdriver]

Mar 5, 2009 14:24:35 GMT @landau1945 said:

No I wouldn't want these works during the week,but first we wouldn't need these if upgrades had been done years ago,in a timely manner like the metro systems in other European cities.
In this current situation then,when will it end? Or are we doomed for years of disruption?

this is what really rattles me:

you have just really criticized what you said really

for new trains, track, signalling etc to work it need to be replaced and maintained in order to do this track has to be closed and they do it during these bank holidays as majority of people travel away and its best time to do it.

Would you rather have a system that works allot better when the work is completed or would you rather they left it and have to put up with signal failures and faulty trains track every day and have suspensions so think before you start comments like that please you cant have it both ways

[Tubeboy]

Lets hope these works bear fruit, unlike the ATO cable debacle on the North end of the Jubilee.

[citysig]

Mar 6, 2009 15:52:27 GMT Tubeboy said:

Lets hope these works bear fruit, unlike the ATO cable debacle on the North end of the Jubilee.

They already have.

The new track is a visible improvement, whilst the new signalling equipment that has been installed is mostly in daily use.

As for a 2-week blockade, although a lot could be done, that would simply not be enough time to do ALL of the work needed, no matter how many staff you throw at it.

[Colin]

And in actual fact if you make a given piece of work bigger - shall we say for arguments sake we'll roll up seven weekend closures into one two week one? - you'll end up with too many workers tripping over themselves, too many guv'nors, too little over control of the entire work site and a bloomin' large risk of a very major over run.

Just look at the Christmas closure of Liverpool Street two years ago for a shining example of how easily a major project can very easily go wrong.

Weekend closures are the best way forward - this work has got to be done - and there will be tangible benefits at the end of it all. How long will it take? I dunno as I'm only a train driver but I can assure you the current level of work is achieving a heck of a lot that won't be obvious to the ordinary Joe public traveller....and it will not last for decades, if that helps

[Deleted]

I really think Joe Bloggs should stop complaining about the closures. It's a case of whether they want the network to recover from years of underinvestment, or would they rather the service levels remain as they are, i.e. woefully inadequate. Personally I'm glad that work is still going ahead given the hostile financial climate just now. Short-term pain for long-term gain, people.

[citysig]

I can understand fully the complaints. I complain when my NR service is disrupted. I don't mind having an easier weekend with fewer trains running at work, but I hate having to catch a bus to get there ;D

But, it is always true that we don't always see what is being done, and these works can seem to last forever.

To be realistic, such works may not end up with an increased service level, or faster journey times. But, what will happen is that the ride quality will improve where track replacement has taken place, and the reliability of the track and signalling will improve - which means less chance of things going wrong.

[neasdena60]

Mar 6, 2009 12:56:53 GMT @funk said:

Mar 6, 2009 8:16:48 GMT metman said:

I think the Met main has quite a flexible layout already. Trains can be reversed at Chalfont, Ricky, Northwood, Hillingdon, Ruislip, Rayners Lane, Harrow and Wembley Park! There are others in the covered way! Maybe Pinner would be a nice option, but as Colin says, its about cost/benefit.

Pinner, hmmmm.... alot of work going on at Pinner, flattening the ground and large ballast sacks at one end.

drains again.