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Post by 21146 on Jun 9, 2009 23:11:42 GMT
Not sure - is the Northern more of an ASLEF line? I think some of the issues on the other lines are now involving signal operators and control staff - it doesn't matter how many drivers are available then! They train managers/volunteers on a generic simulator and then put them on a signal desk so someone told me. They are then supervised by someone else. LU licences are worth nothing and can be extended/revalidated as needbe by the RDO if needs must as opposed to bus or rail certificates in the "real world".
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mrfs42
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Post by mrfs42 on Jun 9, 2009 23:14:54 GMT
LU licences are worth nothing and can be extended/revalidated as needbe by the RDO if needs must as opposed to bus or rail certificates in the "real world". RDO?
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Colin
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Post by Colin on Jun 9, 2009 23:32:19 GMT
Surely not the Rostered Duty Officer? (that's LU's top operational manager for any incident on the railway)
I can't think of any other translation for RDO!
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Post by kewgardensteleport on Jun 9, 2009 23:55:43 GMT
I'd read it as Rostered Day Off. Clearly some wishful thinking going on there...
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mrfs42
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Post by mrfs42 on Jun 10, 2009 8:08:05 GMT
Marv. I'd read it as Responsible Designated Officer; but then I've been reading too many RAIB or MAIB reports of late. ;D
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Post by 21146 on Jun 10, 2009 10:05:24 GMT
It does mean Rostered Duty Officer and they can override the need for a current licence if certain other criteria is met (e.g. previously held, recently expired, accredited prior learning, etc).
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Post by ek583 on Jun 10, 2009 10:37:23 GMT
Just looking at the TFL live travel news site, it seems like the Picc is operating Arnos-Cockfosters and Acton-Hammersmith shuttles only with severe delays, suspended rest of the line. Is it really worth the hassle operating such an extremely limited shuttle service?
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Post by happybunny on Jun 10, 2009 10:47:37 GMT
They are just trying to prove a point Probably ! !
I don't know how they managed to get an Acton - Hammersmith service going.. when I was at Acton picket line earlier it was solid, no drivers booked on (as at 0930hrs).,... My guess is they sent a couple trains empty from North End of line to run this service... just to try and get west end drivers to book on.
Anyway latest from RMT.... have a read of this (what happened last night) :
A PERSONAL MESSAGE FROM THE GENERAL SECRETARY THE TRUTH (AND IF NOT SUE US FOR LIBEL) This is my 31st year as a member of this Union and a worker on London Underground and in all that time I have never experienced such dishonesty from any management that I have dealt with. Let me explain to you what really happened at the talks. The Facts Pay. Management made a revised offer on a two year deal or four year deal. We said we would go away, speak to our members and representatives and come back to them. We said this did not have to be resolved immediately and hence we could suspend the action. Breaches of Agreements. It is an out and out lie that we were only interested in the two sacked drivers. There were another five specific cases where management had abused the disciplinary procedures. It was agreed that ACAS would look at all seven cases and we said that we would be able to suspend the action to allow this to go ahead. On the application of the sickness procedures, management were abusing it by making unannounced visits to members without a Trade Union representative being present. They were also issuing 52 week warnings as opposed to the maximum allowed which is 26 weeks. We reached agreement that the 26 weeks maximum would be adhered to and that a Trade Union representative would be in attendance at the interviews. Redundancies. In 2001 after campaigning that the privatisation of the infrastructure would be a disaster LUL members were transferred to Metronet. We reached an agreement with LUL and Metronet that there would be no compulsory redundancies and that staff would be offered alternative employment in the event of their job going. This was enshrined in members’ contracts. As we predicted Metronet went bust with massive debts. We asked that all Metronet members that came back to LUL, and all other LUL members, should have the same agreement of no compulsory redundancies. At 6 o’clock, and hour before the strike was to begin, agreement was reached with the Acting Managing Director, Richard Parry. In fact I signed a document to this effect and this was to go back in front of your General Grades Committee immediately so that we could suspend the strike. At 6.35 p.m. whilst awaiting the final typed agreement we were told by management that they had made a phone call and that they could no longer abide by the agreement – they reneged before the ink was even dry. We were stunned that management could be so dishonest. I have no doubt that the phone call made was to the Transport Commission or City Hall and they instructed the negotiators to pull the agreed deal. It became quite clear that the Transport Commission or City Hall were using stalling tactics to try and extend the talks to 7 p.m. in the hope that staff would believe agreement had been reached and turn up for work and members were also getting anonymous texts telling them the action was being called off. It is an absolute disgrace that these bodies should interfere in the negotiations taking place between your Union and the LUL management. We negotiate in good faith and expect the same from the other side. It is the management side that have forced this strike to go ahead and now they will have to find a way to deal with the outstanding issues all over again. The RMT want a negotiated settlement without interference from the Politicians. Agreement can be reached if management sit down and negotiate honestly. Thank you for your support – the strike is solid and it is a tremendous effort by all of you. I will write to you with developments. Best wishes Bob Crow General Secretary
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Colin
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Post by Colin on Jun 10, 2009 11:20:29 GMT
And that's meant to be the honest truth is it? This bit is something of contradiction though isn't it?: And there was me thinking that when the RMT announced the strike action, they called for the Mayor to directly intervene. I don't think anyone knows the truth anymore
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Post by Tomcakes on Jun 10, 2009 11:35:27 GMT
I'm afraid the time passed a long time ago when I believed the pap Bob Crow writes. He's no better than any of the politicians he seems to hate so much.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2009 11:58:06 GMT
Unions are as political as the politicians.
However IF this is true "At 6.35 p.m. whilst awaiting the final typed agreement we were told by management that they had made a phone call and that they could no longer abide by the agreement " you can't help but think that Boris has more than a passing input into the disruption.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2009 15:31:26 GMT
I guess living in the real world kinda skews my view, but how can a large and skint company like TfL afford to guarantee no compulsory redundancies? Its precisely this type of agreement that means the public sector is so damn wasteful!
No wonder someone intervened... someone with a bit of sense in my opinion!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2009 15:58:59 GMT
Just because you live in the "real world" doesn't make it right.
Somebody can give a company many years of their skill, ability, life and in return the minute there is a downturn then they're chucked on the scrap heap? Maybe if all those that live in the "real world" had a trade union to look after their interests then perhaps they wouldn't be scared of redundancies or pay cuts.
;D
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Ben
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Post by Ben on Jun 10, 2009 16:48:45 GMT
My generation has been educated and raised to expect that theres no such thing as a job for life or security. In an ideal world there should be, I doub't anyone would want otherwise; but we've been shafted. Money won. So you could say its jealousy, but the vast majority of people who don't have these privilages don't see why its fair that a group could hang on to them, especially in times, as were constantly reminded, of a recession. But hell, why not just join them instead
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Post by Tomcakes on Jun 10, 2009 16:57:16 GMT
If redundancies need made, surely there's a reason for them. Much as management can be idiots, I doubt they feel bored one day and as a way of passing the time until lunch decide to make some redundancies.
In an ideal world, it wouldn't happen, but the ideal world does not exist.
In the real world, it has to be paid for somehow. Promising that not one soul will be made redundant can only mean that the money has to be vired from somewhere else - which will probably be to the detriment of the staff in some other way.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2009 17:05:48 GMT
Firstly not sure if the forum staff want to move this topic off the Bakerloo Line - or perhaps start a new thread.
But the point with redundancies isn't the loss of the position but the compulsory nature of the redundancy. The point being that people can be offered posts within the company and if not then be offered a favourable package to leave.
It may gall that this has got to be "paid" but lets save a few billion from the money Gordon Brown gave to the RBS for totally screwing up. That'd pay for the reduction in positions.
And maybe we could change the "real world" if people had a little backbone and stood up for themselves. IMHO it's scandalous that companies can make millions if not billions of profit but reduce staff to "save costs".
Lets not forget that IF the report is true, a deal was made. This strike could've been called off.
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Post by Tomcakes on Jun 10, 2009 17:09:15 GMT
You're right - I've moved the topic to the main LU forum.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2009 18:45:42 GMT
Just because you live in the "real world" doesn't make it right. Somebody can give a company many years of their skill, ability, life and in return the minute there is a downturn then they're chucked on the scrap heap? Maybe if all those that live in the "real world" had a trade union to look after their interests then perhaps they wouldn't be scared of redundancies or pay cuts. ;D Many years ago, during the days I used to gallavant off out everywhere, and I do mean everywhere... when not at school, I got to know many of the staff at my local stations, on the then Network SouthEast sector. One of them retired after an amazing 48 years service. He was a driver, until he had to take a step down the ladder through ill health. Now, after 48 years service he didn't want to leave the railway, however, retirement called and that was what happened. His leaving party, given to him by his colleagues and managers was an all expenses paid trip for him and his family, to New York - at least he got to see another world railway system. During the unofficial moments I was allowed into the mess room, he imarted some wonderful stories, which made me, take more interest I suppose... The place didn't seem the same without him after he left. Less than two weeks later, I found out some terrible news.
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Post by cetacean on Jun 10, 2009 20:42:32 GMT
it's scandalous that companies can make millions if not billions of profit but reduce staff to "save costs". Big businesses work on the same basis as small businesses. If you ran, say, a local shop or a small factory, you might take on more staff when sales are good (and you were raking it in), but if sales dropped off you'd have little choice but to let some of them go (to cut costs). A business with multibillion pound turnover has exactly the same issues.
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metman
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Post by metman on Jun 12, 2009 18:18:57 GMT
It is interesting in the aftermath of the strike, today on the Met there were a lot of empty stock moves as you'd expect. I had a meeting town and at about 2pm there were a lot of 7XX and 5XX numbers floating around on the mainline. Not sure about other lines.
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