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Post by superteacher on Aug 10, 2010 21:51:36 GMT
Yes, 7 or 8 regularly in service now - that's around 1 in 5 of the total trains on the line. However, I've heard people. even recently, comment that it's their first time on one. My first ride on one was 2 weeks ago today. Every time I've been on the Vic since I've seen an 09 at least. This time next year, people will be getting surprised when a 67 stock turns up . . .
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Post by Deleted on Aug 10, 2010 22:05:17 GMT
Personally I'll be glad when they go. They are too small, hot, loud and just plain ugly! The 09ts feels more spacious than the 465/466s and 376s that they run on Southeastern! Although.. they are respectable as the fact they were the first partially automatic line's stock from introduction and for 41 years (and counting!) now.
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Post by superteacher on Aug 10, 2010 22:34:08 GMT
Personally I'll be glad when they go. They are too small, hot, loud and just plain ugly! The 09ts feels more spacious than the 465/466s and 376s that they run on Southeastern! Although.. they are respectable as the fact they were the first partially automatic line's stock from introduction and for 41 years (and counting!) now. The 09 stock is definitely a better train, but I'll miss the acoustics of the 67 stock as they enter the platform at high speed, and the sound of the brake being applied when they overshoot! 42 years in service on the Vic on September 1st, although some were in service on the Central (Woodford - Hainault) before then. Very respectable service.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 11, 2010 6:53:50 GMT
The 09 stock is definitely a better train, but I'll miss the acoustics of the 67 stock as they enter the platform at high speed, and the sound of the brake being applied when they overshoot! 42 years in service on the Vic on September 1st, although some were in service on the Central (Woodford - Hainault) before then. Very respectable service. I've only ever heard said 'train fart' once ever. The 67s do need to brake earlier than the 09s and 92s though so not quite as high speed but they do on earth whoosh! Probably something to do with the larger tunnels.
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Post by mcmaddog on Aug 11, 2010 7:49:51 GMT
Travelled on it for the first time last night and in the same vain as the buses, two came at once though in opposite directions! Overall really impressed - I like the double seat bench a la 67s - it wasn't busy enough to notice whether you get the bounce when someone sits next to you! I did notice the heat, though it was a different kind of heat to the 67s as it did feel it the air was moving. The other thing was the door sounds, the sounds sound the wrong way around. When the door opens it's an alarm, when it closes it's a little informational squeak.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 11, 2010 9:03:59 GMT
The other thing was the door sounds, the sounds sound the wrong way around. When the door opens it's an alarm, when it closes it's a little informational squeak. The door open sound is quite similar to that of the D78s and 95/96s. Just more stretched out on the low note and repeated..
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Post by antharro on Aug 11, 2010 18:39:51 GMT
I'd be surprised if the majority of commuters get more than 2 Vic-line trains a day, 5 days a week and 1 in 5 trains being an 09 still gives a 4 in 5 chance of each journey being a 1967 (assuming that the 09s always provide exactly 1 fifth of the service). My maths isn't good enough to work out what the probability of all teh trains you get being 67s though! Heh. My only regular travel on the Vic is from Stockwell to Victoria every Friday evening when heading to the coach station. So far, over the last dozen or so weeks, I've been on the 09ts once, seen it in a station (going the other way!) once and just missed catching one once. Although this week I'm travelling earlier than I usually do, so maybe I'll see one again. I do love the sound at Stockwell of trains approaching on the NB platform. Quite an eery sound, starting with the rails vibrating, then as the train gets closer, there's a barely audible near subsonic boom; must be going past a ventilation shaft; then a regular surging sound of air pressure and rail noise followed very shortly after by the sound of 67ts at full chat for just a second before hitting the brakes. On the SB, if you stand on the Vic platform as a train pulls out, and if it's quiet with no noisy people and no Northern line train, you can hear the 67ts motoring all the way down to Brixton. If it's really quiet you can hear it decelerating down on the Brixton platforms. I've missed a couple of Northern line trains listening to this!
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Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2010 8:49:39 GMT
Regenerative breaking systems in general (I don't know specifically about on the Vic) have the potential to overload the electrical supply systems when they feed electricity into it rather than taking it out, and often they have to be upgraded before regenerative breaking is used. It is conceivable therefore that the regenerative breaking is not switched on as doing so would damage the electrical systems of the 1967 stocks which were not designed with it in mind, and which are not worth modifying to cope. I don't know whether the regenerative breaking on the 09s is enabled yet or not, or if it isn't if this is the reason why. If it isn't enabled though, this being the reason would make sense. Regenerative braking is enabled on the '09 Stock, however the voltage has been lowered to 690V as it is not known that the electrical insulation on '67 stock could cope with the 790V that '09 Stock is capable of regenerating at. Once '67 Stock are gone, upping this will give some benefit in terms of regenerative capacity. Also, for regenerative braking to work, the line needs to be receptive to it. This means that either another train or trains need to be taking traction (accelerating) in the same sub section, or the traction power substations need to be capable of running in reverse, and providing electricity back to the national grid. The substations do not support this, so the only time regenerative braking will work is when another train is taking traction in the same section. '09 Stock use very little friction brake 'top up' during braking. The majority of the heat comes from the brake resistors, which unlike any other stock on LU are forced cooled, which dissipates heat from beneath the vehicles more quickly.
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Post by 100andthirty on Aug 12, 2010 20:20:54 GMT
'09 Stock use very little friction brake 'top up' during braking. The majority of the heat comes from the brake resistors, which unlike any other stock on LU are forced cooled, which dissipates heat from beneath the vehicles more quickly. '73, '92, '95. and '96 - and now S stock all have fan cooled braking resistors.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2010 20:59:09 GMT
Went on an 09 stock for the first time today. Got to the Vic platform at Victoria and an 09 came along straight away. Was very impressed, was a very smooth ride with quick acceleration, train was very full so did not get a chance to sit down, did not seem as hot inside as the 67s there was a slightly cool breeze through the train. Liked the way it told you which side the doors would open at the next station, I traveled as far as Warren St.
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Post by superteacher on Aug 13, 2010 9:43:53 GMT
8 2009 stock trains in service in the evening peak yesterday: 211, 216, 234, 236, 237, 246, 271 and 272. However, there were the (almost regular) reformations of trains, so appearance were also made on 215 and 242.
Was looking to see if train 13 was about, not sure if it's been put into service yet though.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 14, 2010 17:20:59 GMT
Had my first ride on an 09 train today, very impressed. Beautifully smooth acceleration and deceleration, very smooth ride, clean spacious interior, good audio and visuals (inside and out), overall a very nice train. Seats I found fine, firm but not as hard as those on the Overground stock. Warm of course, but this will no doubt improve when the long-term tunnel ventilation works come to fruition.
One interesting occurrence – at Victoria all Vic Line trains were stopped for a while for what sounded something like "excessive current leakage at the platform". Eventually trains restarted, a couple of 67s came, then the 09, very slowly – I thought it was coming out of the siding, but it was well populated. It crawled to a halt, then inched forward again before finally stopping and doors opening. After that it behaved normally to Oxford Circus where I got out.
I assume it was under manual control entering Victoria, perhaps to avoid excessive regeneration that may have been the cause of the excessive current.
Incidentally, also the first time I've seen the finished refurbished Victoria and Bakerloo platforms at Oxford Circus – very nice.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 15, 2010 12:54:37 GMT
I took my first 09 stock today, and although it was hot when I entered, it soon started to cool down as we went along. Overall, I was impressed, and it seemed more spacious than the 67 stock.
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Post by Alight on Aug 16, 2010 18:05:47 GMT
I got on the '09 stock for the 3rd time yesterday, interestingly off-peak (me thinking they were only exclusive to peak) between 2 and 3pm. I know that there was another operating at this time going in the opposite direction as I could hear it across platform.
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Post by louvrerivoli on Aug 16, 2010 20:17:53 GMT
I rode on train 9 from Brixton to SS today at around 6:20-ish. While changing at SS for the final leg of the journey to Blackhorse Road, I unpleasantly ran into train 3 again which was directly behind. The former was heating up a bit but not at a critical level. Whereas the latter was exactly the same when I last rode on it.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2010 18:07:41 GMT
I was coming into the N/B platform at Victoria at 1030 and saw an UID 09TS leaving and then I saw 009 at KX on V201 at 1400 heading South
I've got to say that I commute on the Vic Line frequently and haven't been on the 09TS since 21/11/09!
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Post by Alight on Aug 21, 2010 21:49:54 GMT
I've got to say that I commute on the Vic Line frequently and haven't been on the 09TS since 21/11/09! It has been observed that they are becoming increasingly common at the moment; certainly from personal experience, there has been a sharp increase in the past month. As many have hinted above, soon us enthusiasts will be begging for '67s to arrive at platforms!
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2010 17:33:55 GMT
There were 10 in service on Friday in at least one of the peaks - the most at one time so far, it is believed.
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Post by astock5000 on Aug 29, 2010 0:05:30 GMT
Has train 13 entered service yet?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2010 9:26:04 GMT
Has train 13 entered service yet? Yes, think T14 did back end of last week too.
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Post by Alight on Aug 29, 2010 17:34:44 GMT
I got on a 2009 stock on Wednesday and it had the wheelchair board in each car (it separates sets of tip-up seats). This was on the original mock up but the earlier 2009 stock didn't have these. The newer ones seem to have them though.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2010 19:07:49 GMT
I got on a 2009 stock on Wednesday and it had the wheelchair board in each car (it separates sets of tip-up seats). This was on the original mock up but the earlier 2009 stock didn't have these. The newer ones seem to have them though. The wheel chair positions are only in D and D1 cars. Pretty sure there have been no major changes since the mock up to this layout.
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Post by Alight on Aug 29, 2010 20:43:24 GMT
Ah I hadn't noticed them before and assumed they were only every planned but never installed when finally rolled out.
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Post by superteacher on Aug 31, 2010 18:07:31 GMT
My reply from TFL responding to my comments about the heat and driver announcements on the 2009 stock:
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Thank you for your feedback about our new Victoria line trains on 5 August. I am pleased that you generally like the new trains.
I have passed your feedback on to the upgrades team responsible for the new Victoria line trains. With regard to the train operator PA announcements, the team is working closely with the train manufacturers to find the cause of the problem. They have been testing the quality of the PA on a number of different trains and as yet, they have been unable to ascertain why the PA announcements are not of the quality we would like. For this reason, I'm unable to indicate at present when this might be resolved.
I hope you will have noticed a moderate improvement with the temperature on our new trains. To improve matters, we have repositioned where the train sucks in air for the blowers. The reason why we have a lot of heat in these trains is because we haven't yet switched on the regenerative braking system, which cannot be done until all the old trains, which do not have this system, have been replaced which won't be until next spring. All the energy built up in the brakes would normally go back into the line, saving energy.
Tackling heat on the Tube is one of the biggest challenges facing London Underground. We are currently doubling the capacity of all the main ventilation fans serving the Victoria line, in readiness for increases in the speed and frequency of train services. We will then install cooling systems above the platforms at four of the busiest stations on the Victoria line, to feed cool air into the tunnels. Once work on the Victoria line is finished, we will turn our attention to the Piccadilly line ***************************************************************************
Am pleasantly impressed!
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Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2010 19:28:41 GMT
The Bakerloo needs heat issues sorted more than the Picc...
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2010 7:26:38 GMT
When I was on the Vic last night, I rode both. Had no problems understanding the PA on the 09. The 09 was definitely a little cooler on the outbound than the 67 on the return. Though the test is hardly scientific, it is good sign since the return was later in the evening, when I'd expect things should have been cooler.
The 09 I was on must have been one of the earlier ones, because it had an out of date Central London Tube map, showing the ELL under construction. (On that note, looking at the line diagram, I realised that once the ELLX is complete, the Victoria line will connect to all London Overground services.)
One thing that was disappointing is how quickly the trains have become grubby on the exterior. Those tunnels must be an asthmatic's nightmare!
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Post by Chris M on Sept 2, 2010 9:23:56 GMT
(On that note, looking at the line diagram, I realised that once the ELLX is complete, the Victoria line will connect to all London Overground services.) Not quite I don't think, as the ex-Clapham Junction services are the ones that terminate at Dalston Junction iirc. To connect with these, they'd have to build a station on the SLL at Brixton - which would be very beneficial but also massively expensive due to the line being on a very high viaduct over Brixton station.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2010 12:17:38 GMT
(On that note, looking at the line diagram, I realised that once the ELLX is complete, the Victoria line will connect to all London Overground services.) Not quite I don't think, as the ex-Clapham Junction services are the ones that terminate at Dalston Junction iirc. To connect with these, they'd have to build a station on the SLL at Brixton - which would be very beneficial but also massively expensive due to the line being on a very high viaduct over Brixton station. Okay, what about next year then when the extension to Highbury & Islington opens?
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Post by Chris M on Sept 2, 2010 18:48:50 GMT
Still no, due to the West London Line. Ignoring that (as there are some Stratford-Clapham Jn services). When the H& extension opens, it will connect with the Victoria Line, but some services (those from New Cross?) will continue to terminate at Dalston. So the Victoria Line won't connect with either all LO lines or all LO services.
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Post by superteacher on Sept 2, 2010 21:22:25 GMT
When I was on the Vic last night, I rode both. Had no problems understanding the PA on the 09. The 09 was definitely a little cooler on the outbound than the 67 on the return. Though the test is hardly scientific, it is good sign since the return was later in the evening, when I'd expect things should have been cooler. The 09 I was on must have been one of the earlier ones, because it had an out of date Central London Tube map, showing the ELL under construction. (On that note, looking at the line diagram, I realised that once the ELLX is complete, the Victoria line will connect to all London Overground services.) One thing that was disappointing is how quickly the trains have become grubby on the exterior. Those tunnels must be an asthmatic's nightmare! Was it a driver PA or the DVA? The DVA's are all fine, as are some of the driver PA's on some of the trains. It's a bit hit and miss though. Incidentally, there were 9 in service yesterday - saw three in a row for the first time. Train numbers 215, 220, 234, 235, 241, 243, 244 (became 247), 245 and 246 were all 09 stock in the evening peak.
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