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Post by 1018509 on Apr 26, 2011 12:02:09 GMT
Hello to all. A newbie with a question I don't think has been answered yet.
During the late 70's just as the 1973 stock was introduced on the Piccadilly line the line was running 1938; 1956; 1959; 1962; and 1973 stock. This must be some sort of record for one tube line I would have thought. What do you think?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 26, 2011 12:22:01 GMT
A good variety indeed, although the last 1938 on the Picc was early December 1976. At that time there was still the 1956, 1959, 1962 and 1973 making 5 stocks in all until 12/76.
Sorry - correction - last 1938 on Picc was early December 1975. But there were still 5 stocks for a brief period from 19/7/75 (if you count the Hatton Cross opening trip) or 18/8/75 (first day in normal passenger service) up to that time!
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Post by trc666 on Apr 26, 2011 13:14:55 GMT
Victoria has the most at the minute doesn't it? You have 67, 72 and 09 all running presently.
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Post by Dstock7080 on Apr 26, 2011 13:19:14 GMT
Victoria has the most at the minute doesn't it? You have 67, 72 and 09 all running presently. Sticking up for the bigger trains, the District had: C69/77, CO/CP, D and R (of various vintages) running together. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 26, 2011 13:24:57 GMT
OK. I'll stick up for the big trains too ;D ;D You could add that some of the trailers in the CO/CP Stock were ex-Q38!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 26, 2011 13:39:50 GMT
Define stock (how many are included in 'Standard' or 'Q'?). Define line.
Contenders that spring to my mind are the Central, when the first '62 stock arrived, or the Met and District at various dates (up to the arrival of the last D)
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 26, 2011 14:49:44 GMT
Indeedie - this could go on for a bit !! ;D ;D
The Met would also be a front runner, competing with the District in years gone by.
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Post by uzairjubilee on Apr 26, 2011 15:01:58 GMT
72 on the Victoria? Am I missing something?
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Post by Chris W on Apr 26, 2011 15:07:08 GMT
72 on the Victoria? Am I missing something? You sure did ;D ;D ;D Car 3016 was damaged in an accident at Northumberland Park some years ago, was subsequently withdrawn and now resides in unrefurbished condition at Low Hall Museum Walthamstow. A 72DM was taken and renumbered 3016 to keep the 4 car unit running.... there are apparently a few of these cars that have been merged into 67ts units. I'm sure other members will have the car numbers to confirm  |
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Post by trc666 on Apr 26, 2011 15:08:44 GMT
3016 certainly is still at Low Hall, went there a week ago to have a look at it, the front of it is rather bashed up!
The 'second' 3016 has now been scrapped up at Rotherham with the rest of its unit.
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metman
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Post by metman on Apr 26, 2011 16:10:53 GMT
Before the A stock too over the Met, there were loads of different stocks on the mainline.
O/P stock, CO/CP stock, F stock, T stock, Bogie Chesham Stock, Steam Stock and A60 stock!
The Northern Line at one point would have had 1938, 1956, 1959, 1972mkI and 1972mkII stock!
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Post by uzairjubilee on Apr 26, 2011 16:18:01 GMT
72 on the Victoria? Am I missing something? You sure did ;D ;D ;D Car 3016 was damaged in an accident at Northumberland Park some years ago, was subsequently withdrawn and now resides in unrefurbished condition at Low Hall Museum Walthamstow. A 72DM was taken and renumbered 3016 to keep the 4 car unit running.... there are apparently a few of these cars that have been merged into 67ts units. I'm sure other members will have the car numbers to confirm Oh. Well, you learn something new everyday ;D. Thanks for clarifying that! |
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metman
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Post by metman on Apr 26, 2011 17:33:35 GMT
Just to add a bit more, there were quite a few cars of 1972mkI stock added to the Victoria and Bakerloo Lines.
On the Victoria, the 72 stock cars were used as middle motors and therefore did not have to be modified in terms of ATO and OPO. Generally, a double ended 67 unit was split in two with one 67 M-T being paired with a 72 T-M.
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Post by norbitonflyer on Apr 26, 2011 20:12:04 GMT
Just to add a bit more, there were quite a few cars of 1972mkI stock added to the Victoria and Bakerloo Lines. On the Victoria, the 72 stock cars were used as middle motors and therefore did not have to be modified in terms of ATO and OPO. Generally, a double ended 67 unit was split in two with one 67 M-T being paired with a 72 T-M. I'm sure I posted this recently, but according to my (1993) edition of the LU stock book D-end cars 3101/3/5/7/22/41/52 and A end cars 3080-6, (and their adjacent trailers), are ex-1972 Mk 1 cars 3317,3323,3529,3325,3320,3516,3316,3217,3527,3223,3225,3520,3216,3220. The original owners of the D end car numbers were renumbered 3180-6. 3081 and 3084 were originally D end cars (remember that 1972 stock had twice as many D end cars as A end cars) Bakerloo unit xx64 were former Mk 1 cars (units 3203, 3401) |
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Post by andypurk on May 2, 2011 21:46:21 GMT
Just to add a bit more, there were quite a few cars of 1972mkI stock added to the Victoria and Bakerloo Lines. On the Victoria, the 72 stock cars were used as middle motors and therefore did not have to be modified in terms of ATO and OPO. Generally, a double ended 67 unit was split in two with one 67 M-T being paired with a 72 T-M. I'm sure I posted this recently, but according to my (1993) edition of the LU stock book D-end cars 3101/3/5/7/22/41/52 and A end cars 3080-6, (and their adjacent trailers), are ex-1972 Mk 1 cars 3317,3323,3529,3325,3320,3516,3316,3217,3527,3223,3225,3520,3216,3220. The original owners of the D end car numbers were renumbered 3180-6. 3081 and 3084 were originally D end cars (remember that 1972 stock had twice as many D end cars as A end cars) Bakerloo unit xx64 were former Mk 1 cars (units 3203, 3401) As were Bakerloo line 4 car units 3265 (ex 3218), 3266(ex 3224), 3267 (ex 3210) and 3 car units 3465 (ex 3407), 3466 (ex 3424) and 3467 (ex 3412). |
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Post by andypurk on May 2, 2011 21:53:52 GMT
Victoria has the most at the minute doesn't it? You have 67, 72 and 09 all running presently. Sticking up for the bigger trains, the District had: C69/77, CO/CP, D and R (of various vintages) running together. Of course, if the 1956, 1959 and 1962 are being counted separately, then the C69 and C77 should also be (without even wondering if the two nearly new units from 2008 should be another sub-type), as should the CO and CP types  |
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Post by Deleted on May 2, 2011 22:01:41 GMT
59 and 62 do actually have some major differences though.
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Post by norbitonflyer on May 2, 2011 22:04:57 GMT
but according to my (1993) edition of the LU stock book Bakerloo unit xx64 were former Mk 1 cars (units 3203, 3401) As were Bakerloo line 4 car units 3265 (ex 3218), 3266(ex 3224), 3267 (ex 3210) and 3 car units 3465 (ex 3407), 3466 (ex 3424) and 3467 (ex 3412). About time I bought a more recent edition! |
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Post by Dstock7080 on May 2, 2011 22:27:41 GMT
About time I bought a more recent edition! You shouldn't have too long to wait until the new edition ! |
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Post by andypurk on May 2, 2011 23:05:16 GMT
59 and 62 do actually have some major differences though. More so than the CO/CP or the C69/77? Units of the 1956, 1959 and 1962 stocks could all work together, despite any differences in equipment. |
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Ben
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Post by Ben on May 2, 2011 23:29:14 GMT
Yes indeed. The 62ts electric relays were plug-in, instead of being hard wired, the drivers brake controllers were poppet vales instead of rotary type ones, and they had an MA instead of an MG.
The C69/77 were nearly identical, and upon refurbishment became even more so.
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Tom
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Post by Tom on May 3, 2011 0:08:32 GMT
Not to mention the differences on the driving desk itself (which I'm sure Tubeprune can enlighten us on) and in later years the position of the stabling light etc etc...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 3, 2011 19:51:22 GMT
The Circle Line has at present on it:- C69 / C77 / D Stock (Southern Half) / A Stock (Northern half) / S Stock (Northern half), five different train types serving parts of that line.
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Post by andypurk on May 3, 2011 20:23:57 GMT
Yes indeed. The 62ts electric relays were plug-in, instead of being hard wired, the drivers brake controllers were poppet vales instead of rotary type ones, and they had an MA instead of an MG. The MA/MG generator is probably the most significant of these, from the point of view of the hardware. However, none of the listed differences prevented the units from working together and being treated as a single type when in service. Many mainline units have similar detail differences within the same class of unit and many LU classes have the odd one or two units with greater differences than these (used for prototyping new equipment etc.) And what about the CO/CP stocks, where amongst the differences were the position of the guard within the DM cars (either in a cab, or at the trailing door of the passenger accommodation). |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 3, 2011 21:43:48 GMT
I really dont know much about the CO/CP's. All the C's are pretty much the same equipment wise whereas the 59ts had control pillars like the 38ts did and the 62ts had a drivers desk like on the A stock and also the different locations for the stabling light.
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Post by astock5000 on May 3, 2011 21:58:44 GMT
As were Bakerloo line 4 car units 3265 (ex 3218), 3266(ex 3224), 3267 (ex 3210) and 3 car units 3465 (ex 3407), 3466 (ex 3424) and 3467 (ex 3412). Except cars 4366-3366, which were 4349-3349. They were spare due to an accident at Picc Circus, and replaced damaged Mk1 cars 3224-4224 (4324-3324 were converted to D end, becoming 3266-4266). |
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Ben
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Post by Ben on May 3, 2011 23:30:03 GMT
For the COCP stock I could only regurgitate facts from books. There are people on the forum who are far better placed to answer such questions, having had first hand experience with them. But OP stock seem to have been notorious for nearly-but-not-quite issues.
Subtle differences in required driving styles of mixed formation trains have been alluded to on here before. Such as trains having a 72mk1+72mk2 formation, and the 59+62 combination. Oddities only experienced by subtle equipment differences being combined. At least I think they have...; TP and others are best placed to comment on specifics though!
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Post by tubeprune on May 4, 2011 15:32:06 GMT
I really dont know much about the CO/CP's. All the C's are pretty much the same equipment wise whereas the 59ts had control pillars like the 38ts did and the 62ts had a drivers desk like on the A stock and also the different locations for the stabling light. Actually, the 56/59TS had BTH Type C707 master controllers - the desk type like the R Stock. The A and 62 Stocks had a plate which was fitted over the master controller and e.p. brake controller so they were covered on one level. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 4, 2011 16:15:53 GMT
Just repeating what I read somewhere!
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Post by andypurk on May 4, 2011 19:00:15 GMT
As were Bakerloo line 4 car units 3265 (ex 3218), 3266(ex 3224), 3267 (ex 3210) and 3 car units 3465 (ex 3407), 3466 (ex 3424) and 3467 (ex 3412). Except cars 4366-3366, which were 4349-3349. They were spare due to an accident at Picc Circus, and replaced damaged Mk1 cars 3224-4224 (4324-3324 were converted to D end, becoming 3266-4266). Indeed, I tried to check all the vehicles matched, but missed this pair of reconfigured Mk II cars. There is also the famous(?) Mk II unit 3299 formed: 3299 (ex 3357), 4299 (ex 4357), 4399 (ex 4257) and 3399 (NDM ex 3439) and so having no center cab. |
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