East London Line for MSTS

[Deleted]

Hi there,

With the excellent 38TS Cab from Dr Jimi and Darren Carter, i have decided to restore efforts on my previously abandoned East London Line for Microsost Train Sim.

This will be a completely new build of the line, my previous one was pathetic to say the least the infamous snooker table landscape. MSTSimmers will understand what i mean, lol.

I have the track plans, Signal Layout, East London DEV. so hopefully a fairly accurate representation can be made of the line.

I would however like to consult with Dr Jimi as his District Line is the currently definative view of the LU in the MSTS world and i wouldn't want my East London not to match up to his standards.

All Thoughts Comments and Queries feel free to post here or PM me. Any Information is most welcome as well!

~ Matloughe

[agoodcuppa]

Can I suggest you ask the existing (and past) LU staff for analysis as you progress?

When constructing an item, there's no substitute for site visits and lots of photos and drawings with accurate dimensions. Ask for expert opinion at each stage rather than leave it till the end and try and correct everything.

Excuse me if I'm teaching Granny etc...

Best of luck.

[DrJimi]

Go for it and have fun doing it. Reasonable DEM (terrain) data is available as a start. I'd be glad to offer my LUL signal set for your use, and can add any 'specials' (unusual head configurations) that may be needed. Having recently obtained the ELL/District (DD) CD the ELL looks to me to be a very interesting line to build -- and not too big as to make it a career job ;D If you don't have it already, I strongly recommend Xtracks as a track standard. I can also offer you my 4-rail textures that work with it.
As 'Good Cuppa' notes, there is no real substitute for visit/photos. The cab videos (and I now have 4 of the District) can only show you so much from given angles. I also have over 1000 photos of stations, trackwork and various other detail kindly provided by many on this board. That's the only way I could build the DL from 3000 miles away. Yell if/when you need help. And keep frequent backups! The MSTS route editor can turn treasure into trash in a heartbeat.
Looking forward to your progress!

[agoodcuppa]

A second thought while reading Dr Jimi's post.

Attention to detail is crucial. If you get the details right then everything will be spot on.

Best of luck.

(BTW - Don't forget St. Mary's Curve so you can connect to Dr Jimi's when he gets there.)

[Deleted]

Thank you very much for your kind offers Dr Jimi, if it wouldn't trouble you too much could i take those track textures and signalling files please?

I have used UK Finescale in the past but it's lack of a 4-Rail means i can't use it this time, lol. So i am learning when it comes to X-tracks.

I intended to start at Shoreditch, because simply it only has a few months left of being open so now would be a good time to go and photograph it. I am however no object builder as of yet, but hopefully i can get TSM and the other items i require for building the objects in the near future. ;D

~ Matloughe

[Deleted]

Hi There i thought i'd post just to re-assure you this route won't become Vapourware or Abandonware or anything like that. This is from the very early stages of construction, notice the perfectly flat terrain.

Dr Jimi i have DEM'ed this terrain but as you can see to no affect unfortuneately but it doesn't matter i will do the scenery by hand.
Can anyone guess where this is?

Dr Jimi my respect for you is immense now i see how difficult X Tracks is to use.

[DrJimi]

Xtracks isn't difficult - just different. Although I thought the same as you about UKFS Once you get the hang of the track part naming conventions it becomes much easier. There's also some good examples in the documentation.

Why no terrain? Which DEM tool are you using (DEMex?) Where'd you get the DEM raw data? I only ask as I had no trouble applying it so you may have a fundamental problem that may bite you later. Trust me - getting the terrain right first does help (as I learned when I had to re-do the Richmond road). The RE has lousy tools for manipulating terrain shape, so doing it all later by hand will be a major chore. Useful tip: Placing tracks and appropriate use of the "Y" key (blend terrain to track elevation) will allow you to create required embankments and cuttings easily. If you don't yet have a copy, I strongly endorse Michael Vone's MSTS Route Building Guide. I still refer to my copy to remember his neat 'how-to' tricks.

[Deleted]

I must be getting somewhere, this is a view from pretty muc hthe same area a few hours after the previous shot.

The P has come off of it's turn to be replaced with a Terrier taking some workmen in a 'Brakevan Special' to Shoreditch



Note St Mary's Curve to the left of the photo. One problem i have found is that certain items cannot be covered by tunnels, the crossover is a prive example of this. So in the future i am going to have to think about how i am going ot cover this...

[agoodcuppa]

That looks very promising.

(Can I be picky and suggest that the brakevan is out of it's correct time period? ;D )

[Deleted]

Lol, i know the brakevan is out of the time period. I realised thta a little too late ;D I promise 'Standard Issue' LT Brakevans from now on, lol. Possibly an LT Pannier Tank if i can get through some of my issues atm.

Dr jimi i need you experiance, i used Google Earth to get the Long&Lat for DEMing the ELL again. However in The Route Geometry Extractor the Long&Lat didn't match up to the vectored geographical area. It gave me somewhere near guildford in the RGE when it is supposed to be Wapping on Google Earth. Could you shed any light on this?

[DrJimi]

Not sure what you mean by "vectored geographical area". You use the RGE initially to define the tiles you wish to use for a route. These can be realistic lat/lon or not. I chose to be realistic, as it seesm you are too. All that gets you is a defined area with a lot of flat grass on it.
Next step, if you wish to apply DEM data, is to detmine the data is needed. The data come in sets that cover areas. Thus you'd need the sets that cover your range of lat/longs. Grab the right data sets and use DEMex (preferred) to apply the data. That gets you some green turf with bumps on it. Gentle bumps usually, unless there are some serious hills nearby. Now create a marker file specifying the locations of your stations so the marker poles appears in MSTS. Voila - grassy bumps with poles here and there. Now all that's left to do is everything else (i.e. lay track inteh right diretions between stations, following required gradients). Use the "Y" key after laying track to make the terrain exactly conform to track elevation (cuttings, embankments).

2 suggestions that I know will help you...
1. Grab the Michael Vone Route Buildnig Guide. It's worth it's weight in gold, and describes in illustrated steps how to do everything you'll need to do.
2.. Go to UKTs, Route Building forum, and read/print out the stickied thread about "How to apply DEm data in 5 easy steps". It tells you how to figure the data sets you need, where to download them, where to get a free copy of Demex, how to use it to apply the data. Foolproof! I'm, living proof of that, cos that's how I did it.

If I'm off-base, let me know. It's unclear to me how you're defining the area in RGE, and how you're applying DEM data. I don't see how a lat/long error could occur.

Hope this helped...

[Deleted]

I've figured it out with some help from my good friends, ;D

The route is DEMed now, and markers are in place for the stations, more markers shall follow so that i can build up a reasonably accurate picture of the route before track laying will re-commence.

Finally i am going to build a route right, right from the start. ;D ;)Isn't it exciting? lol.

[agoodcuppa]

You're off to a good start, keep it going.

(And don't worry too much about chronologically displaced rolling stock. )

[mowat]

matloughe said:

I must be getting somewhere, this is a view from pretty muc hthe same area a few hours after the previous shot.

The P has come off of it's turn to be replaced with a Terrier taking some workmen in a 'Brakevan Special' to Shoreditch



Note St Mary's Curve to the left of the photo. One problem i have found is that certain items cannot be covered by tunnels, the crossover is a prive example of this. So in the future i am going to have to think about how i am going ot cover this...

I see you have got a real steam loco on there at last.
The Terriers rule

[Deleted]

Okay time for an update,

i have laid all the track. In it's correct place. and here is the proof the East London Line as you may not have seen it before!!!


I'll be doing some Cab Photos when i have scenerized some more.

[richardh]

Will this route be freeware, or payware? Also, I assume UKTS is it's host if it's payware?

Oh, and will a new A stock be made fior MSTS?

Cheers, and some great work and pics! ;D

[Deleted]

Freeware definately, lol.

To be honest it is going to take me ages as i gotta learn to make models and shapes so it will be completed as my own ambitions will allow me.

Just done the first run over the line this morning. It's good, only problem is that all the stations look the same so this is where the model building will now have to come into it.

Time will tell. This route is also being documented on UKTS as well.

[Deleted]

Okay here are some progress shots, please have an open mind as i haven't even begun to create custom scenery for the route yet.


Surrey Quays Station, the single crossover is just visible in the far right of the cab window before the 'M' Door.


Brunel's Tunnel, single bore. Dark... and tunnel like.


Wapping Station, see what i mean about them all looking alike?


Approaching Whitechapel, the double track junction leads to St Mary's Curve and ultimately the rest of the SSL network. The Double crossover is visible beyond that and just at the other end of the tunnel you can just make out the East London Platforms.

Any thoughts or comments?

~ Gaz

[agoodcuppa]

matloughe said:

Any thoughts or comments?

IIRC the platforms at Wapping are significantly narrower than usual.

[richardh]

Good shots, although, the stations you showed are all underground... But, as you said, work is still to be made. Good luck!

[Deleted]

Hope you'll be improving Brunel's tunnel!

Sam

[Deleted]

I just showing you guys that it isn't gonna dissappear, into thin air,

I know Wapping's Platforms are much narrower, i am intending to build the murial wall and position it close to the edge, so the platform would appear to be very narrow.

Brunel's Tunnel is a trickyone to answer, as the textures are generic so changing the texture would mean all the tunnels would look like it... howeveri could see about building a Facade that looks like the tunnel and placing it between the train and the actual tunnel, thus obscuring the horrible generic tunneling.

BTW: I don't believe Surrey Quays is in Tunnel, Rich ;D

~ Gaz

[richardh]

Must be getting confused. Although, all stations north of the river are in tunnels aren't they (except Shoreditch)?

[Deleted]

Whitechapel is sort of not in tunnel.

[Deleted]

matloughe said:

i am intending to build the murial wall and

Who is she?

[Deleted]

Am I silly in saying this? there is no 4th rail.

[Phil]

descendingsadly said:

Am I silly in saying this? there is no 4th rail.

Actually, there's not even a third rail yet.

[Deleted]

Yep thats right no Third or Fourth Rails yet, i haven't applied the track texture to change them, namely because i don't have it yet, same reason there is no signalling yet. But that'll change. Just give me time. ;D

[marty]

Anyway, still lookin good so far...

[Deleted]

I have managed to source some LU 4-Rail Track Textures, and also the free GMax 3D shape builder, although as you can imagine i am a complete novice at building a shape and am going to take my time over it.

I intend to start on something easy, and relatively useful... a LU Station Roundel would be a good idea i think.
Any Thoughts?