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Post by ruislip on Apr 3, 2008 3:51:45 GMT
This comes from a WTT from May 1990. A code will appear such as AM5, BK9, UX0, et al. I can identify the letters being the terminus of the train; but what about the numbers? Are they used to identify if the train is fast, semi, or slow? Do some of them refer to the arrival platform at the train's final destination?
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mrfs42
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Post by mrfs42 on Apr 3, 2008 5:54:35 GMT
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metman
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Post by metman on Apr 3, 2008 10:24:54 GMT
I don't think T/ops normally know what platform they are going to arrive in at places like Baker Street (unless there is only one platform, or they are on an Amersham train that normally terminates on plat 4).
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Post by c5 on Apr 3, 2008 21:44:41 GMT
I do have the full list somewhere, I'll try and dig it out!
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mrfs42
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Post by mrfs42 on Apr 3, 2008 22:06:56 GMT
Oo. Yes please. ;D
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Post by c5 on Apr 3, 2008 22:28:51 GMT
God, I wish I had a scanner ;D ;D ;D Sorry to HarSig if I'm repeating what's in t'other thread   ;D This is the Train Desprictions Codes for the Signalling Control Centre. Adding an A after each description indicates all stations including Jubilee line between Finchley Road and Neasden. Adding an O indicates all stations on the Metropolitan line. NorthboundWAT1/UXS1 (Semi Fast)From Finchley Road calls at Wembley Park,Harrow on the Hill then All Stations AME2/CHM2/RKY2/WAT2 (Semi Fast)From Finchley Road calls at Harrow on the Hill then All Stations. WAT3 (Semi Fast)From Finchley Road calls at North Harrow then All Stations UXS4 (Semi Fast)From Finchley Road calls at Harrow on the Hill then All Stations AME5/CHM5/RKY5 (Fast) From Finchley Road calls at Harrow on the Hill, Moor Park, then All Stations AME6/CHM6/RKY6 (Fast)From Finchley Road calls at Moor Park, then All Stations AME7/CHM7/RKY7 (Fast)From Finchley Road calls at Wembley Park, Harrow on the Hill, Moor Park then All Stations SouthboundBKM1/MOR1/ALD1 (Semi Fast)All Stations to Harrow on the Hill then Wembley Park, Finchley Road then All Stations BKM2/MOR2/ALD2 (Semi Fast)All Stations to Harrow on the Hill then Finchley Road, then All Stations. BKM3/BKM4-BK8/BK9All Stations to Baker Street from Watford or Uxbridge BKM5/MOR5/ALD5 (Fast)All Stations to Moor Park, then Harrow on the Hill, Finchley Road, then All Stations BKM6 (Fast)All Stations to Moor Park, then Harrow on the Hill, Wembley Park, Finchley Road, then All Stations |
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Post by Colin on Apr 3, 2008 22:30:20 GMT
I'm soo pleased this subject has come up, and that Harsig describes the TD meanings (ie, BK6) in the linked thread, as this is so very relevant to my (and Alex's) upcoming secondment on the Met. Obviously the letters (BK, WF, A, etc) are easy to suss..........but 'decoding' the numbers was a little harder  ;D ;D ;D ;D |
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Post by c5 on Apr 3, 2008 22:31:11 GMT
I'm soo pleased this subject has come up, and that Harsig describes the TD meanings (ie, BK6) in the linked thread, as this is so very relevant to my (and Alex's) upcoming secondment on the Met. Obviously the letters (BK, WF, A, etc) are easy to suss..........but 'decoding' the numbers was a little harder ;D ;D ;D ;D Name me all the Ealings ;D ;D ;D ;D |
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Post by Colin on Apr 3, 2008 22:33:43 GMT
Ermmmm..... ;D ;D ;D
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metman
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Post by metman on Apr 4, 2008 0:03:24 GMT
Ha ha!! Thanks guys, it was great to actually work out what it all meant!!
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Post by Harsig on Apr 4, 2008 8:01:58 GMT
God, I wish I had a scanner ;D ;D ;D Sorry to HarSig if I'm repeating what's in t'other thread ;D This is the Train Desprictions Codes for the Signalling Control Centre. Adding an A after each description indicates all stations including Jubilee line between Finchley Road and Neasden. Adding an O indicates all stations on the Metropolitan line. NorthboundWAT1/UXS1 (Semi Fast)From Finchley Road calls at Wembley Park,Harrow on the Hill then All Stations AME2/CHM2/RKY2/WAT2 (Semi Fast)From Finchley Road calls at Harrow on the Hill then All Stations. WAT3 (Semi Fast)From Finchley Road calls at North Harrow then All Stations UXS4 (Semi Fast)From Finchley Road calls at Harrow on the Hill then All Stations AME5/CHM5/RKY5 (Fast) From Finchley Road calls at Harrow on the Hill, Moor Park, then All Stations AME6/CHM6/RKY6 (Fast)From Finchley Road calls at Moor Park, then All Stations AME7/CHM7/RKY7 (Fast)From Finchley Road calls at Wembley Park, Harrow on the Hill, Moor Park then All Stations SouthboundBKM1/MOR1/ALD1 (Semi Fast)All Stations to Harrow on the Hill then Wembley Park, Finchley Road then All Stations BKM2/MOR2/ALD2 (Semi Fast)All Stations to Harrow on the Hill then Finchley Road, then All Stations. BKM3/BKM4-BK8/BK9All Stations to Baker Street from Watford or Uxbridge BKM5/MOR5/ALD5 (Fast)All Stations to Moor Park, then Harrow on the Hill, Finchley Road, then All Stations BKM6 (Fast)All Stations to Moor Park, then Harrow on the Hill, Wembley Park, Finchley Road, then All Stations As you note these are the versions of the descriptions used in the SCC at Baker Street which differ from those used in the time table and the signal cabins in that they use a three letter code for the destination rather than the two used elsewhere. Sometimes it is obvious where the extra letter is derived from but I couldn't tell you why 'S' is the extra letter in the Uxbridge descriptions. You also seem to have left a few out e.g. (Letters in brackets indicate equivalent two letter code used in WTTs etc) RUI0(RU),RAY0(RL),WEM0(WP),WEM7,NE,LIV0(LS),LIV5,SPEC(S) and my personal favourite NWON. There are probably more that have yet to spring to mind such as ALD6, and I haven't even started on the list of codes relating to the Jubilee (eg SMDW), H&C (eg TRIX), or District (eg OLYV) It is also worth noting that as far as the BK0,BK3/BK4 & BK8/9 descriptions are concerned they are used as follows: Trains originating on the Watford Branch will be allocated either BK3 or BK4 and these will be used alternately. Trains originating from the Uxbridge Branch or Harrow on the Hill will be allocated either BK8 or BK9 and these will be allocated alternatley. Trains originating from all other destinations or trains diverted/short tripped will use BK0. |
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mrfs42
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Post by mrfs42 on Apr 4, 2008 9:22:06 GMT
Sometimes it is obvious where the extra letter is derived from but I couldn't tell you why 'S' is the extra letter in the Uxbridge descriptions. I'd suggest Nixie tubes would play a part in this, in times long past. |
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Post by c5 on Apr 4, 2008 9:54:08 GMT
Sometimes it is obvious where the extra letter is derived from but I couldn't tell you why 'S' is the extra letter in the Uxbridge descriptions. I'd suggest Nixie tubes would play a part in this, in times long past.  (and me knows what nixie tubes are ;D) |
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Post by Harsig on Apr 4, 2008 10:02:32 GMT
Sometimes it is obvious where the extra letter is derived from but I couldn't tell you why 'S' is the extra letter in the Uxbridge descriptions. I'd suggest Nixie tubes would play a part in this, in times long past. That might have been the case had Baker St SCC been older than it is. Remember I'm only talking about the codes used within the SCC system which, while it is definitely obsolete, is sufficiently modern to allow you to use any ASCII character you like in the codes. |
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mrfs42
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Post by mrfs42 on Apr 4, 2008 10:36:57 GMT
Indeed - but from lots of digging around in 80+ years worth of paper I've come to the conclusion that whenever any LU resignalling work takes place the bits you can't explain are to do with the previous system or the system before that! ;D IME if you dig back far enough you'll find a clue to an answer. In this case it'll be 4 pin drums, ribbon storage, nixie tubes or a programmer that thought UXbridge Sidings would be a jolly good wheeze for the codes.  |
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Post by JR 15secs on Apr 4, 2008 11:19:18 GMT
When the TD system was replaced in the 1960's the LSI's that were issued gave details of what the codes meant, as someone who worked in the cabin at Baker Street before the programme machine was installed I have first hand experience on using the drums (4) that were on the relay room wall which had to match what was in the timetable.
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mrfs42
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Post by mrfs42 on Apr 4, 2008 11:36:33 GMT
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Post by JR 15secs on Apr 4, 2008 12:50:56 GMT
Will have a look when I get home.
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Post by JR 15secs on Apr 4, 2008 13:11:06 GMT
Just spoken to someone who knows the codes. Will still check hope this helps.
AM0, AM5, AM6, AM7, (AM2 added 1982ish)
WF0, WF1, WF2, WF3
UXA, UX0, UX4
CM5 this was originally CM6
RK5 this was originally RK0
HHA, HH0, HHE
WPA, WP0
BKN
RU0 added 1973ish
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Post by ruislip on Apr 4, 2008 19:11:35 GMT
Do other lines have a similar roster of codes for their services in their WTTs?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2008 19:24:14 GMT
Do other lines have a similar roster of codes for their services in their WTTs? No |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2008 0:52:18 GMT
I'm soo pleased this subject has come up, and that Harsig describes the TD meanings (ie, BK6) in the linked thread, as this is so very relevant to my (and Alex's) upcoming secondment on the Met. Obviously the letters (BK, WF, A, etc) are easy to suss..........but 'decoding' the numbers was a little harder ;D ;D ;D ;D Name me all the Ealings ;D ;D ;D ;D E,EC,ES ? |
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Post by ruislip on Jul 26, 2008 3:01:59 GMT
Why do the Met WTTs of today use "LM" for the Chiltern services, when British Rail faded into oblivion back in the 90s?
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Post by Harsig on Jul 26, 2008 9:20:00 GMT
Why do the Met WTTs of today use "LM" for the Chiltern services, when British Rail faded into oblivion back in the 90s? Because the 1960s installed train describer equipment has not been modified to reflect the change of ownership and to be honest there is no real reason why it should be. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2008 12:23:33 GMT
Just spoken to someone who knows the codes. Will still check hope this helps. AM0, AM5, AM6, AM7, (AM2 added 1982ish) WF0, WF1, WF2, WF3 UXA, UX0, UX4 CM5 this was originally CM6 RK5 this was originally RK0 HHA, HH0, HHE WPA, WP0 BKN RU0 added 1973ish There are both RK0 and RK5 descriptions used |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2008 23:53:05 GMT
Why do the Met WTTs of today use "LM" for the Chiltern services, when British Rail faded into oblivion back in the 90s? Because the 1960s installed train describer equipment has not been modified to reflect the change of ownership and to be honest there is no real reason why it should be. There is also the fact that LM (London Midland) deputises equally well for another meaning (London Marylebone). Have the G codes ever been allocated to anything other than ECS Chilterns? |
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Post by mrfs42 on Jul 29, 2008 18:15:51 GMT
Have the G codes ever been allocated to anything other than ECS Chilterns? Surely they would have been used for Goods trains as originally intended? |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 29, 2008 21:31:58 GMT
Have the G codes ever been allocated to anything other than ECS Chilterns? Surely they would have been used for Goods trains as originally intended? Obviously, but the overlap between the introduction of the TD system and the cessation of freight traffic is undoubtedly shorter than the period of time where freight traffic was no longer present. Harsig once said that after the freight trains stopped, the G codes were eventually allocated to ECS traffic to and from Marylebone. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2008 8:40:05 GMT
We use a 'g6' description for empty chiltern moves. HTH
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