ELL staff

[Deleted]

what is the fate of the ELL staff for stations and trains, will they be transferred to 'Overground' or what?

do the ELL drivers do all A stock routes or just the ELL?

[Colin]

I'm sure they'd like to know too

As the line will be closed for some time, it's hard to see what the new operators would do with any 'inherited' staff......

That said, I'd like to think that the staff on the ELL will at least be given some form of choice over wether to stay with LUL or move into the new operating company.

As for the drivers of the ELL A stocks - they only drive them on the ELL..........and they do all the empty stock transfers to & from Neasden.

[Deleted]

so some start their day at New Cross and have to travel to Neasden?

do they not have a depot on the ELL for maintanance.

how often do they do these moves, and do they happen during the day?

[Colin]

rob said:

so some start their day at New Cross and have to travel to Neasden?

Yes, all drivers book on at New Cross. See below for answer to second part of question.

rob said:

do they not have a depot on the ELL for maintenance.

They have a depot at New Cross, but only for the very lightest of maintenance. All other maintenance is carried out by Neasden depot.

rob said:

how often do they do these moves, and do they happen during the day?

Based on a copy of old duties that I have (old, but very recent ):
on mondays to fridays, two return trips were scheduled - One return trip was around lunch time (NX-NN-NX), the second trip to Neasden was in the evening, with the driver travelling back to New Cross 'on the cushions'. A night driver got a taxi after close of service, from New Cross to Neasden, and brought a train back at the start of service.

On saturdays, there was one return trip in the early evening (NX-NN-NX).

On sundays, there was one return trip - overnight and worked by a night driver (NX-NN-NX).

[Deleted]

ELL drivers are road trained on the fast and local lines to Harrow, I believe one of the moves was timetabled to run first to Harrow then back south to Neasden depot.

[Deleted]

I got a lift with an ELL train/op last week. He advised that they have been told what will happen to them as the line will close on dec. 22nd 2007.

He told me that the waiting lists for the other depots are being frozen i.e no more people will be added to the lists until the ELL drivers have been added to the lists for their preferred depots.

[Deleted]

at any rate they will have to go a long way, there's not many depots near New Cross.

[Deleted]

The t/op that I spoke to had put in a nomination for barking. I had thought that some of the guys at new cross might opt for the met as they would already be road trained on the A60s but neasden as a fair trek for most of them.

[Deleted]

at least it would let them off the ELL to somewhere more interesting!

[Deleted]

jubblyman said:

The t/op that I spoke to had put in a nomination for barking. I had thought that some of the guys at new cross might opt for the met as they would already be road trained on the A60s but neasden as a fair trek for most of them.

I would expect very few to go to Neasden. Drivers usually like depots close to home, and most like more time training so would prefer a different stock to make the most of the training time.

[Deleted]

Would the drivers get the option of remaining on the ELL? Hence they'd become employed by a NR TOC, get a transferable skill and will retain the roughly the same pay ?

[Tubeboy]

Good point Simon, also, will the station staff get the same benefits [staff travel, pay etc] as their LU cousins?

[Deleted]

tubeboy said:

Good point Simon, also, will the station staff get the same benefits [staff travel, pay etc] as their LU cousins?

Station staff working for NR TOC's are the very poor relatives to their LU cousins. Earning around £10k less than LU.

Given that the shorter working week means that all LU station staff can be displaced at a drop of a hat, I'm sure all ELL station staff will find themselves on the west end of the Met Line.

[Deleted]

From what I understand, staff of the TOC's are quite poorly paid compared to LU staff. I know that southern's gateline staff get around £15k and first capital connects drivers get about £32k which I suppose is decent. Some of my friends are SA's at the ELL stations and they would rather stay with LU than risk losing any pay.

[Deleted]

As the line will be closed for a while, even if staff wanted to stay on the line then there would be a break in their employment.

I think the nearest alternative depot is North Greenwich, but the Jubilee Line would be a pretty radical change from the ELL!

[Deleted]

Good point. Hopefully, if any of the guys from the ELL go to the jubbly, the road training should be o.k.

[Deleted]

Idea:

If they have route learning up the Met Main on the lines to Harrow - how about train them up on a seperate line but keep their route card updated so during a staff shortage they are possibly able to operate trains between Harrow & Liverpool Street.

[Deleted]

Good idea. If they move to another depot, they could be possibly be brought in to cover the route from aldgate to harrow during any shortages.

Just a thought, does this practice occur on any other parts of the network?

[Deleted]

Doubt it TBH.

[Colin]

Drivers have to be assesed every six months over routes they are qualified to work on, and have a stock refresher every twelve months.

Couple that with other regular training, annual leave, etc - it just wouldn't be practical or cost effective.

There has often been talk of having drivers qualified to work across the SSR - but the powers that be know it would be a lot of hassle for a small potential benefit.

Edit: Also, say you had these drivers all trained up and used them on an alternative line - who will then cover their rostered turn on their 'home' line? You'd need to have more drivers in reserve, which rather defeats the object.

[Deleted]

Well an idea may be during periods of staff shortage that the staff concerned are rostered as Spare?

[Deleted]

jubblyman said:

I got a lift with an ELL train/op last week. He advised that they have been told what will happen to them as the line will close on dec. 22nd 2007.

Bit of a revival I know, but saw this and was surprised, indeed the ELL still features on T/Op nomination sheets (if you've just applied to be a driver) and also people are still being sent there to be trained! I met someone around three months ago who told me he was beginning T/Op training on the ELL!!!

Strange old world.

[Colin]

well..........they still have to provide a service for another 12 months.....

[Deleted]

colin said:

well..........they still have to provide a service for another 12 months.....

This is true, with the existing drivers transfering away.