When it all goes wrong?

[Deleted]

Am I right in thinking that in times of difficulty any DLR unit can be matched as the leading unit?

[Deleted]

That is indeed the case- all units in a train carry the SelTrac equipment.

[Deleted]

Old and new types cannot work together. Each LRV has its own on-onboard controller, but if there is a mechanical fault that won't help anyway!

[dazzmcguinness]

I'm still confused by the DLR. Does it run automatically and is operated remotely/by computers, or is the guy on the train really necessary for driving the things?

And if it's the former, how does it manage to account for things like wind-resistance or different levels of friction on the tracks to make sure it stops at the right times?

'McGuinness

[Deleted]

It is ran automatically, but the (insert politically correct title - not Train Captains anymore are they?) control the doors and starts the train. They can also choose to control the train manually from the front.

[Deep Level]

Jan 21, 2011 9:28:20 GMT @eirikho said:

It is ran automatically, but the (insert politically correct title - not Train Captains anymore are they?) control the doors and starts the train. They can also choose to control the train manually from the front.

They are known as PSA's.

Everything I'm about to say refers to when I was a huge enthusiast of the DLR in my younger teenage years, So things may have changed.

When DLR trains stop at a station the doors automatically open. The PSA then uses a control panel which are situated by every door on the train, to close the doors. There is one button marked 'COD' (Close Other Doors) and another marked 'CTD' (Close This Door) and another marked 'ROD' (Re-open Other Doors). PSA's will close all the other doors then once closed they will close the door they are using. Once all doors have closed and the train is RTD, the train will automatically depart.

Alternatively PSA's can use the EDP at the front but this is only really allowed between West India Quay & Crossharbour (that's why you will never see a PSA using the EDP at Poplar) barring certain circumstances. When using the EDP PSA's have to press the Close button which closes all the doors unlike the door panel. They then press the start button. They can also reopen all the doors from here, providing they haven't pressed the start button yet.

Any more questions I'd be happy to answer them, I haven't lost my DLR knowledge just yet ;D

[dazzmcguinness]

So is this all something that can be done automatically, closing doors? If you give the train and the passengers a limit of 90 seconds, then a ten second warning prior to that, that the doors will close then surely there's no need for staff?

And no way that the DLR 'drivers' could go on strike?! darrenmcguinness.wordpress.com/2011/01/20/mcguinness-on-even-the-robots-are-striking/

Is it purely a safety thing? I would have thought that computers would be better for ensuring passenger safety...

'McGuinness

[Chris M]

the doors will automatically close after about 2 minutes, but passengers can reopen them until the PSA closes/locks them remotely.
The train cannot depart until the PSA gives the train permission, either from a doorway or at the front (which can be used everywhere if needed).
Whether the trains could be programmed to operate entirely automatically I don't know.

[dazzmcguinness]

So is this technology something that could be implemented on the rest of the tube? Big Boris said it was likely last week, but I didn't believe him at the time.

'McGuinness

[davidp]

Jan 21, 2011 17:46:34 GMT Chris M said:

the doors will automatically close after about 2 minutes, but passengers can reopen them until the PSA closes/locks them remotely.

Do they? You may well be correct but I've never heard that anywhere else and as a regular DLR user have not really noted that. I have however been on trains where the PSA has been aware of a delay so has closed the doors but then immediately pressed the 'Re-open Other Doors' button. And I've also been on trains where the train has been held for 5 minutes or more and the doors have not closed.

As for full automation, I guess there would be a H&S issue (how would the automated system know that everyone had alighted or boarded the train for instance?) and what would happen if the automated system broke down and the train had to be driven manually? Also don't forget that the PSA is responsible for revenue protection.

[Chris M]

Well I don't actually know that, but it was what I observed the other day. We were delayed for over 5 minutes at Royal Victoria westbound, the PSA was dealing with what I presume to be an alarm activation in the other car and the doors closed a couple of times after being opened by passengers (initially alighting as normal, then a few decided to seek other means of getting to their destination).

The alarm started about 2/3rds of the way from Custom House when the PSA was operating the train from the front. There was a PA message that I didn't catch all of but definitely included the words "train captain". The PSA shut up shop at the front and made his way back along the train looking at all the alarm points and the doors as he went. The alarm continued to sound until some time after we'd arrived at Royal Victoria.

It's the first time I've experienced this on the DLR.

It's the first

[Deleted]

I expect the doors were closed by the PSA, then re-enabled (ROD) again. They often do this just to keep the heat in during the Winter - they are not the warmest of trains to sit on, especially at those dizzy high up stations with the wind blowing a gale. I am not aware of any timer as such - if there is its a recent new modification, but I suspect its the PSA doing it.

[Chris M]

The unit I was on was one of the new design, so it's possible that these units have a timer while the older ones don't. I shall ask next time I see a non-stressed looking PSA.

[Deep Level]

Jan 22, 2011 14:14:45 GMT davidp said:

As for full automation, I guess there would be a H&S issue (how would the automated system know that everyone had alighted or boarded the train for instance?) and what would happen if the automated system broke down and the train had to be driven manually? Also don't forget that the PSA is responsible for revenue protection.

This is an excellent point. DLR trains have a tendency to stop in the wrong place especially during bad weather and if a DLR train is not perfectly docked (above the marker) the doors will not open. The PSA has to go the EDP at the front and manually shunt it forward onto the docking marker.

[davidp]

Jan 24, 2011 1:59:11 GMT Chris M said:

The unit I was on was one of the new design, so it's possible that these units have a timer while the older ones don't. I shall ask next time I see a non-stressed looking PSA.

I've been travelling to and from Tower Gateway a lot recently. The trains stand in the station for about 7 minutes between arrival and departure and I've experienced all the various varieties of stock over the past few days. All of my trains have sat there with their doors wide open for the full 7 minutes or so. Sorry sir and with respect, but I'm beginning to believe that it was the PSA on your train manually closing the doors rather than any automated system.

[pib]

There is no automatic timed door closure, it's totally up to the PSA if he wants to close doors to retain heat. However at TOG there are enough confused tourists about without confusing them further with closed doors and it's a fairly well enclosed station anyway.