S Stock

[Deleted]

Sept 19, 2010 16:25:33 GMT prjb said:

Sept 17, 2010 23:16:29 GMT @shedcompnodosh said:

That's all rather dependant on whether Uxbridge get's sorted out over the coming months !!!

Do you mean the issues with the station or the issues with the sidings? I suspect you mean the latter, but either way it is my job to sort them both out!

In any case, I am confident that we will resolve our issues at Uxbridge. This weekend has seen a large amount of work in the sidings.

I'm reffering to both, the former carrying rather more of a question mark than than the latter in terms of the heritage status bestowed upon Uxbridge station and it's environs. The work required appears fairly simple on the surface but you never know with these matters!

The latter carries a completion date rather close to the implementation of WTT329 for comfort and having born witness to some of the work booked for Rickmansworth that didn't happen as planned I have my doubts as to how smoothly the Uxbridge works will go!

That said, this is no show stopper to the implementation of the timetable itself, I guess it boils down to how quickly the trains start to arrive if the Uxbridge branch is delayed.

[Deleted]

Sept 20, 2010 18:21:11 GMT deadmans said:

It would also help if LUL had a depot ready, to under take a full service and maintenance program on them. You can build as many as you want, but if you cannot stable them on the line, or maintain them....

A small but rather important POINT. ;D

A while back you said "More delays on delivery, with the depot crying out for the next train."

What's it to be? I really can't understand the negativity shown about this subject. Does it really matter when they finally displace the A Stock?

[Deleted]

Sept 21, 2010 6:39:03 GMT @whistlekiller said:

Really can't understand the negativity shown about this subject. Does it really matter when they finally displace the A Stock?

If you're an A stock train it does!

Also, we'd like to have more S stock in service by the Olympics. Can't let the Tube make the cardinals think we're a third rate operation here. That's the job of the roads and the airport.

[harlesden]

The A-stock remains very smart and stately. Surely it's the 92TS lets the side down.

[Deleted]

Sept 21, 2010 7:38:24 GMT @harlesden said:

The A-stock remains very smart and stately.

Some of the carriages smell of stale wee , and if you are in a motor car - prepare for some major vibration! (and not a good kind :

[Deleted]

Sept 21, 2010 8:15:41 GMT futurix said:

Sept 21, 2010 7:38:24 GMT @harlesden said:

The A-stock remains very smart and stately.

Some of the carriages smell of stale wee , and if you are in a motor car - prepare for some major vibration! (and not a good kind :

Right and if I went and took a wee in an 09 stock right now, in a weeks' time you're saying it wouldn't smell of stale wee?

[metrolander]

You have to consider the accumulations involved! Also, I'd wager far more weeing goes on out in the sticks in empty trains than it does at any point on an entirely underground line.

I think the point is, the A stock may retain their stately air to a degree but surely it's a bit of a departure to describe them as 'smart'?? The Met was always my regular line, just recently I've been back on it a bit for the first time in a while; the trains look sorry.

Deadmans' whimsical negativity reference anything to do with the S stock does provide an amusing, melodramatic soap opera on the side!

[harlesden]

If the stench of years of cigarette odour can be eliminated, it can't be so hard to eliminate the smell of week old pee.
Nobody's mentioned the A60 "bounce".

[Deleted]

The A60 bounce is what gives them so much character! The ride difference between the two is very significant. The S stock is very smooth but the A stock bounces like mad! With the bouncy seats that makes for an interesting ride...

[metman]

The reason the A stock is looking very sorry, is that less care is being taken of their external appearance!

They are still great trains and do a fine job. They are old, but so are my parents - I'm not complaining, although everyone has their moments.... ;D

[harlesden]

Sept 21, 2010 19:03:09 GMT @cj said:

The A60 bounce is what gives them so much character! The ride difference between the two is very significant. The S stock is very smooth but the A stock bounces like mad! With the bouncy seats that makes for an interesting ride...[/[/b]quote]

Never forget the time a very large middle-aged Caribbean lady came to sit directly opposite me - skirt suited Church sister type. Instead of being offended by my occasional gaze, she smiled, unbuttoned her suit jacket and sort of pushed her chest out. Rather impressive it was too.
Sorry, am I lowering the tone of the forum?

[Deleted]

Sept 21, 2010 19:52:21 GMT @harlesden said:

Sorry, am I lowering the tone of the forum?

After all the edited posts about the smell of urine on A60s I'd hardly say you were mate..........

[vato]

It is true that the stale urine problem has got much worse compared to last year. One journey sat sat down = immediate change of clothing required. It's nasty in a way I've never experienced on the underground before. Has the internal cleaning regime been relaxed now the S stock is "closer"?

[metrolander]

:-) I'm sure the A60's characterful bounce has provided many wonderful and varied benefits over the years!

I didn't mean to sound harsh on the A stock; Metman you may recall from previous posts, I like them! They have such huge nostalgic significance to me. Clearly the lower priority on external appearance is one thing, but I have to say that I also think the trains are starting to feel older when you ride in them now - again, that's not harsh they're just showing their age... Really, if I'm honest, the grandeur of the Met line experience was reduced from when they got rid of screaming line speeds. I am aware of the reasons and the neccessity but it throws a harsh light on the stock's poor acceleration by today's standards; that used to be negated by the low-level flights between Wembley/Harrow and Harrow/Moor Park!

Also, not sure about the machine/human analogy. I mean I'm all for mechanical sympathy but whilst everyone's parents all get old surely, they were never designed to be scrapped and replaced at some point?! (As it happens, my parents are exactly the same age as A stock...)

[metman]

I know you like them, and so do I. It is interesting how acceleration has become an important topic. Even trains like the 67/72 stock seem sluggesh now. I guess the A stock has never been quick off the mark, but they can shift sometimes. Normally if the weak field is off. I wouldn't be using it on the Uxbridge branch at least!

The train are showing their age, but the body work is in better condition than the C stock corrosion wise.

[Deleted]

Sept 21, 2010 20:50:46 GMT @metrolander said:

:(As it happens, my parents are exactly the same age as A stock...)

Both of my parents are as old as F stock.
I am as old as UNDMs 30022 - 30045 and 31000 - 31045.
The three of us are still in daily service!

[Deleted]

My parents are 72 and 73(t)s, and just like the trains, it's easy to see which is the younger one!

[citysig]

Could we keep in context that the "bounce" is a characteristic of the A-stock coupled with the track, and is one of the things they should be remembered for.

The smell of urine or indeed anything else is related to the abuse all our trains receive on a regular basis from London's travelling public. I am sure that with the advent of air-conditioning and easier to clean surfaces the odour problem will be tackled a little more than it can be now, but let's keep in focus that it is your fellow passengers who create the environment on our trains, not the depot staff (at least I would hope not ;D)

[metrolander]

Yes of course, the track plays a part too but my immediate thought is still of the trampoline-ish seats; I guess perhaps an extra degree of softness was required to avoid serious injury when that suspension/track/speed triangle was in full effect?!

As for the vandalism, I'd like to think all the discussion about that sort of thing so far has been on the basis that it's the actions of lout passengers, I certainly wasn't talking about depot staff I'd be highly surprised if anyone else was??

I wonder what the latest is re A stock retirement, I know that's a touch OT but it's what we're touching on more now. I saw the old thread with detailed dates, but surely that's slipped somewhat now

[den]

Does anybody know if the BBC London story tonight about safety issues with trains related to the S Stock, or did they just decide to film it because it's new?

[Chris M]

Sept 22, 2010 18:01:10 GMT @den said:

Does anybody know if the BBC London story tonight about safety issues with trains related to the S Stock, or did they just decide to film it because it's new?

I've not seen the report on the BBC but there are three stories in today's Standard about tube safety issues.
The first relates to 2 or 3 incidents of injuries caused to passengers by inter-car barriers becoming partially detached from Central Line trains in (iirc) January 2008.

Secondly there was mention of the recent serious incidents on the Northern and District lines in the context of LU/TfL being prosecuted for H&S breaches. It wasn't clear whether these were the incidents being prosecuted or not (seems a bit quick to me, particularly for the Plaistow incident).

Thirdly there union claims that lift and escalator maintenance engineering teams were suffering a 33% reduction in staffing. The union quoted was predicting serious safety issues at Hampstead and Belsize Park (being the deepest stations)

None of these relate to the S stock or the Metropolitan Line.

[Deleted]

Sept 22, 2010 18:57:16 GMT Chris M said:

Sept 22, 2010 18:01:10 GMT @den said:

Does anybody know if the BBC London story tonight about safety issues with trains related to the S Stock, or did they just decide to film it because it's new?

I've not seen the report on the BBC but there are three stories in today's Standard about tube safety issues.
The first relates to 2 or 3 incidents of injuries caused to passengers by inter-car barriers becoming partially detached from Central Line trains in (iirc) January 2008.

Secondly there was mention of the recent serious incidents on the Northern and District lines in the context of LU/TfL being prosecuted for H&S breaches. It wasn't clear whether these were the incidents being prosecuted or not (seems a bit quick to me, particularly for the Plaistow incident).

Thirdly there union claims that lift and escalator maintenance engineering teams were suffering a 33% reduction in staffing. The union quoted was predicting serious safety issues at Hampstead and Belsize Park (being the deepest stations)

None of these relate to the S stock or the Metropolitan Line.

LU are being taken to court by the ORR for breach of H&S at work Law in relation to the loose/flapping ICB. I'm sure it said that they will be pleading guilty, but were upset that they are being prosecuted as the safety regime, is .... err... safe normally.

I understand that there have been some incidents involving escalators, including a fire/smoke from one that was not detected by automatic equipment, it made the news.

[vato]

I'd like to point out that I am fully aware that the urine problem is absolutely caused by some of my fellow travellers rather than staff. My question was if we've just been unlucky in having a rise in such vile activities, or if the cleaning regime is different, or if the age of the cushions now makes it impossible to sort out, or some combination thereof and/or something i haven't thought of. "Don't know" is also a perfectly valid position to be in.

Regarding bounce, it's a mixed bag - fun for kids it seems and sometimes quite exciting for adults, but not so good for reading/typing/texting/sleeping and definitely a problem for those with bad backs or other injuries.

[citysig]

Sept 22, 2010 18:01:10 GMT @den said:

Does anybody know if the BBC London story tonight about safety issues with trains related to the S Stock, or did they just decide to film it because it's new?

There was also a brief mention of some rolling stock issues earlier yesterday morning. But as the issues meant delays to services (trains cancelled) and there were no actual safety breaches (despite somebody telling the press there were) this story only got a few words, and seems to have died a death elsewhere.

[cso]

Apparently the S-Stock is running in passenger service this morning... presumably due to the minor issues with trains on the Met line?

What's the passenger-service clearance for the s-stock now, still wembley - watford or has it been extended?

[citysig]

2 (yes 2 ;D ) S-stocks are being made available for passenger service between Wembley and Watford for both morning and evening peaks. They are both covering for cancelled Watford services.

Last night I used them on the 1624 and 1657 Wembley Park departures towards Watford (and 2 other return trips later). Probably be much the same times this evening depending on Train Operator availability.

[Deleted]

Out of interest, what is the 2nd S stock now available for passenger service, I know unuts 21003+21004 are out.

[astock5000]

It must be 21007, as that is the only other production train that has been delivered.
Also, an S stock train is one unit, not two, so 21003 and 21004 should always run together.

[Deleted]

Many thanks.
I was under the inpression these were 2 units semi-permanently coupled together.
The other part of 21007 must be 21008?

[Deleted]

Oct 21, 2010 0:19:59 GMT @marks said:

Many thanks.
I was under the inpression these were 2 units semi-permanently coupled together.
The other part of 21007 must be 21008?

I am under the very same impression.