Swanage Sunday Specials - August 2019 - LUL 4TC set

[pauluni]

The 4TC set will be used for 4 railtours from London Waterloo to the Swanage Railway, calling at Woking and Basingstoke. Prices are £74.50 for standard class (£64.50 for junior tickets) and £105 for first class. First class compartments can be booked for £570 by phone only. The Dates are:

• 28th July www.ukrailtours.com/product/swanage-sunday-special-number-one/
• 4th August www.ukrailtours.com/product/swanage-sunday-special-number-two/
• 11th August www.ukrailtours.com/product/swanage-sunday-special-number-three/
• 18th August www.ukrailtours.com/product/swanage-sunday-special-number-four/

In association with GB Railfreight, the Swanage Railway and London Underground Ltd, we are delighted to bring you news of a series of inexpensive day trips from London Waterloo, Woking and Basingstoke, running right through to the Swanage Railway.

The train will be formed of the distinctive London Transport red-liveried 4TC set, topped and tailed by Class 73/1 locomotives. We will travel via the South Western Main Line, via Winchester, Southampton and the New Forest. Passing Bournemouth we skirt Poole Harbour and at Worgret Junction we veer left on to the Swanage branch.

The branch itself, now one of Britain’s leading preserved railways, is full of interest and offers the passenger some delightful views of some of the finest scenery in southern England. We pass the sidings at Furzebrook which for many years kept the branch alive. After passing the modern ‘park and ride’ station at Norden we get a wonderful view of the dramatic ruin of Corfe Castle, towering above the picture postcard village of the same name.

You can either alight at Corfe or remain on board for the last few miles to the neatly restored terminus at Swanage, right in the heart of the town and just a few minutes’ level walk to the sandy beaches. The bustling resort is full of eating and drinking places – what better treat than enjoying freshly cooked fish and chips as you gaze over the bay and take in the sea breezes!

We will be at Swanage for around three hours (if you alight at Corfe Castle your break there will be around 40 minutes longer). You will be entitled to a reduced return fare on the scheduled Swanage Railway steam trains.

Please note that First Class accommodation is in six-seat side corridor compartments. Most Standard Class seating is in ‘open’ carriages. Light refreshments will be available.
Although this tour will be running on four successive weekends, do bear in mind that the TC is only a four-car train so capacity is limited. Early application is therefore recommended.

Thread split from Heritage Services ~MoreToJack

[bassmike]

Anyone know if the 4TC set is still able to control a loco/other unit?

[norbitonflyer]

Jan 31, 2019 13:01:10 GMT bassmike said:

Anyone know if the 4TC set is still able to control a loco/other unit?

I would guess if a 4-car set has to be topped and tailed by two class 73s, the answer is, sadly, probably no. One Class 73 should be adequate to operate in push-pull mode on electric power o the SWML, and also on diesel power at the speeds permitted on the Swanage Railway.

(Of course, the second 73 could simply be there for insurance, but despite their age 73s are entrusted to handle the West Highland Sleeper single-handed - these do, of course, have new - and much bigger - diesel engines)

[35b]

Jan 31, 2019 14:03:16 GMT norbitonflyer said:

Jan 31, 2019 13:01:10 GMT bassmike said:

Anyone know if the 4TC set is still able to control a loco/other unit?

I would guess if a 4-car set has to be topped and tailed by two class 73s, the answer is, sadly, probably no. One Class 73 should be adequate to operate in push-pull mode on electric power o the SWML, and also on diesel power at the speeds permitted on the Swanage Railway.

(Of course, the second 73 could simply be there for insurance, but despite their age 73s are entrusted to handle the West Highland Sleeper single-handed - these do, of course, have new - and much bigger - diesel engines)

The issue may also be crashworthiness regulations. With the TC being Mk1 rolling stock, there may be issues with it leading the train with passengers aboard.

[MoreToJack]

Jan 31, 2019 13:01:10 GMT bassmike said:

Anyone know if the 4TC set is still able to control a loco/other unit?

It is - it was used a couple of years back on a previous visit to the Swanage with a class 33 in push/pull mode. I'll see if I can find the relevant links.

[phil]

Jan 31, 2019 14:03:16 GMT norbitonflyer said:

Jan 31, 2019 13:01:10 GMT bassmike said:

Anyone know if the 4TC set is still able to control a loco/other unit?

I would guess if a 4-car set has to be topped and tailed by two class 73s, the answer is, sadly, probably no. One Class 73 should be adequate to operate in push-pull mode on electric power o the SWML, and also on diesel power at the speeds permitted on the Swanage Railway.

(Of course, the second 73 could simply be there for insurance, but despite their age 73s are entrusted to handle the West Highland Sleeper single-handed - these do, of course, have new - and much bigger - diesel engines)

A more vital question is "does the LUL 4TC unit have working TPWS and OTMDR loggers in the cabs?"

It is forbidden for ANY driving cabs to be used on the national rail network unless the above is fitted - though agreements with LUL mean that older tripcock fitted stock may be used (I imagine the S stock on the subsurface lines do have OTMDR)

The TC unit was used as hauled coaching stock last year between Wareham and Swanage but had to be top & tailed if I recall correctly.

[bassmike]

Thanks for replies B M

[Deleted]

Might have to see this , not often the 73/1s get out much anymore except for RHTT and SITT.
Can the 4TC work like a DBSO and control the locomotive? I understand it's top and tailed but shame can't get great shot of the driving end of the tc

[spsmiler]

I wonder if the toilets will be enabled - they are normally closed on LUL heritage train events but this is not a big issue as there are many stations which have toilets and the journeys on the 4TC are not very long.

But all the way to the south coast is a different issue.

By the way, I can guess its some sort of speed recording device, but exactly is OTMDR? Oh and what do the letters in this acronym stand for?

[Chris M]

I think OTMDR is a blend of acronyms of multiple names for the same thing:
On-Train Data Recorder (OTDR)
On-Train Data Monitor (OTDM)
On-Train Monitoring and Recording [equipment] (OTMR)

Whether the different names are from different vendors/manufacturers and/or different systems* and/or denote different methods of achieving the same end (or something else entirely) I don't know. In colloquial terms "black box" works fine for all of them.


*in the same way that passenger trains operated by a single crew-member is Driver Only Operation (DOO) on the mainline but One Person Operation (OPO) on the Underground.

[phil]

Feb 24, 2019 20:39:35 GMT spsmiler said:

I wonder if the toilets will be enabled - they are normally closed on LUL heritage train events but this is not a big issue as there are many stations which have toilets and the journeys on the 4TC are not very long.

But all the way to the south coast is a different issue.

By the way, I can guess its some sort of speed recording device, but exactly is OTMDR? Oh and what do the letters in this acronym stand for?

OTMDR is the railway equivalent of an aircraft 'black box' - and as such it monitors a lot more than speed!

While its functionality is somewhat limited on older stock, it will still show whether the driver was trying to accelerate or brake, when the horn was used, when the AWPS was cancelled, whether the TPWS was activated, etc.

No driving cab is permitted to be used on the national rail network unless OTMDR is fitted (with the possible exception of certain tube stock which presumably has grandfather rights for particular sections of NR infrastructure or NYMR Heritage locos used on the Grosmont - Whitby section of the Esk Valley Branchline)

(AWS - Automatic Warnin System)

(TPWS - Train Protection and Warning System)

[phil]

Feb 23, 2019 17:43:37 GMT @railrecorduk said:

Might have to see this , not often the 73/1s get out much anymore except for RHTT and SITT.
Can the 4TC work like a DBSO and control the locomotive? I understand it's top and tailed but shame can't get great shot of the driving end of the tc

Erm.... Yes the 4TC end coaches are exactly the same as a DBSO in that they can be used to control a class 33/1 loco, a class 73 loco or indeed many of the 1950s / 1960s build 3rd rail EMU units!

However for the 4TC unit owned by LUL to be used in this way it requires the fitting of all current safety features demanded for driving cabs in NR infrastructure plus has to be maintained to the required standard.

As LUL use the unit simply as hauled coaching stock, I very much doubt they are investing cash in maintaining driving cabs which they have no use for.

[Tom]

Feb 25, 2019 12:03:39 GMT phil said:

As LUL use the unit simply as hauled coaching stock, I very much doubt they are investing cash in maintaining driving cabs which they have no use for.

I believe they have previously driven trains using the 4TC, with Sarah Siddons on the back. It was around 2000, from memory.