Door Open Lights Inside The Train?

[spsmiler]

Someone has asked me this .... Inside the carriage is a small orange light that comes on when the doors open. Do you know the purpose of this light?

My first thought was that its just a light which illuminates when the doors are open, but maybe I am wrong? Maybe there is more to it than simply meets the eye?

Anyone know more?

Simon

[Chris M]

Could it be to aid fault finding - a quick way to highlight which doors are registering as open?

[rincew1nd]

I'd suggest it's linked to the external orange lights which illuminate when doors are not fully closed, the internal light could assist staff in locating a dodgy door in fault conditions.

[commuter]

Yes, on the Bakerloo line the Outside Door Indicator Light is repeated inside at certain places.

[piccboy]

Wonder if these were in the car where the Guards panels used to be?

[t697]

Yes it's been added to assist fault finding and routine maintenance tasks.

[orangelightboy]

<<Thread merged - goldenarrow>>

Hi

For many years I've noticed and been curious about the tiny orange light, located inside the carriages above the rows of seats on Bakerloo trains, which comes on whenever the doors are open. I'm sure you know the one I mean, but if not here's a video. I've been asking around for years and nobody has given me a satisfactory answer as to why it exists. The other day I was on a Hidden London tour at Shepherd's Bush and the very knowledgable tour guide had no idea either, but pointed me in the direction of this forum - so hello!

It presumably isn't just to let passengers know the doors are open, because from wherever you're sitting and can see the light you can also see the doors. 

I saw a tweet suggesting that it's for drivers to find out which carriages has doors that aren't closed, but surely they could also tell by looking? And anyway it seems odd for it to be for maintenance reasons when engineers are testing the doors, because the light is inconveniently located away from the doors in the passenger seating area...?

So, please put me out of my misery (and if possible explain in non-train-geek terms) - why is that light there?

And a follow-up question... what is it specifically about Bakerloo line trains that makes this light necessary? Are there any other trains that have it?

Thank you!

[Dstock7080]

Nov 1, 2022 13:57:06 GMT orangelightboy said:

I saw tweet suggesting that it's for drivers to find out which carriages has doors that aren't closed, but surely they could also tell by looking?

And a follow-up question...what is it specifically about Bakerloo line trains that makes this light necessary?

It is sometimes difficult to tell looking at a door if the interlock has successfully been made, an internal orange light helps locate said door/s

1972 Stock are not fitted with a cab mounted door monitor equipment, other than usual “doors closed” indicator, so walking through the cars, especially if the train has started moving out of a station helps investigate.

[t697]

I'm pretty sure the in saloon miniature repeater of the outside Door Fault Indicator Lamp (orange light) was added for Maintainers. When testing, adjusting or setting up the door interlock switches, a form of 'Go/No Go' gauge is used at the door closing gap. One checks whether the interlock is made or open by observing whether the orange light is on or off. Typically it was easy to temporarily withdraw the lamp holder into the saloon so the whole adjustment can be done by one person working alone from within the saloon.
After Refurb in the 90s access to the lamp was difficult or impracticable so the miniature repeater was added to avoid making it a two person job.

I'm not 100% sure why only 72TS, but I suspect it's because other stocks have another method of monitoring the interlock switch operation single handed while checking or adjusting.

[spsmiler]

I know what you mean but cannot answer the 'why'.

All I can add is that I do not remember this on 1972ts when they were new.

Nor, for that matter any other LT train - whether new or old (CO/CP, R, A, C, D, Standard, 1938, 1959/62, 1972, 1983, etc). However there are internal 'door open' lights on the 2009ts and S Stock. These too are small and its a case of passengers needing to know that they are there to know that they exist!

[t697]

Nov 1, 2022 20:28:27 GMT spsmiler said:

All I can add is that I do not remember this on 1972ts when they were new.

However there are internal 'door open' lights on the 2009ts and S Stock. These too are small and its a case of passengers needing to know that they are there to know that they exist!

Yes, I can confirm added to 72TS, not original fitment, for the reason I outlined.

I'm a frequent S stock user and sitting here at home have forgotten where their equivalent is just now!

[spsmiler]

Near the top, close to some of the doors, magnifying glass recommended!

Well meaning but the implementation renders these lights about as useful as the proverbial chocolate teapot.

[AndrewPSSP]

Once again this forum has corrected my prior misconception! I used to think it was a pilot light from the days where 72s had a guard...

[spsmiler]

Nov 4, 2022 14:19:35 GMT AndrewPSSP said:

Once again this forum has corrected my prior misconception! I used to think it was a pilot light from the days where 72s had a guard...

From what I remember the pilot lights were inside the car but always blue and at the places where the guard worked, as otherwise they might not be visible when the trains are crowded.

The orange 'scrambled egg' lights also only illuminated when the passenger doors were open but these were outside the trains so that platform staff could see them too. These helped the platform staff see where on the train the open doors were located so that they could go and see if there was an issue - such as a stuck door that needed a human kick, push & shove* to help it close or passengers holding the doors open for other passengers.

*Asking it nicely "excuse me Mr Door will you now close please" never worked!!!

[DWS]

Pilot light was blue not orange.

[class411]

I remember it (in carriage pilot light) as a very violet tinged blue.

[jimbo]

Pilot light illuminated when all doors were closed. The external lights on each car were introduced with post-war stocks, and illuminated when a door was open on that car. I don't think either system showed which side the open door was! Presumed to be on the platform side, but not necessarily. And if platforms used on both sides, then could be unclear.

[t697]

Nov 2, 2022 13:24:40 GMT spsmiler said:

Near the top, close to some of the doors, magnifying glass recommended!

Well meaning but the implementation renders these lights about as useful as the proverbial chocolate teapot.

I'm not convinced on S stock internal lamp for door closed proving. More specifically?

[Dstock7080]

Nov 6, 2022 17:46:10 GMT t697 said:

I'm not convinced on S stock internal lamp for door closed proving. More specifically?

It is just a visual warning that doors are opening/closing, that's all.

[t697]

Yes I'd thought of that Doors Closing light but it's exactly that, a visual version of the beeps. I thought someone was implying the equivalent of DFIL in the saloon, which I don't think S stock has. Not on the schematics I looked at anyway ;-)