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Post by imran on Apr 26, 2024 11:55:49 GMT
You might have heard about this by now. There will be a 16 day closure of the Chingford Branch between 20th July and 4th August so a bridge over the railway can be replaced. During this time: No London Overground service between Hackney Downs and Chingford. Enfield Town/Cheshunt services will run as normal. NR services to/from Hertford East will start/finish at Stratford instead of Liverpool Street. NR services between Liverpool Street and Cambridge/Stansted Airport will divert via Seven Sisters instead of Tottenham Hale. Services between Stratford and Meridian Water/Bishop’s Stortford will not operate. More details can be found here: 👇 www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk/news/vital-bridge-replacement-means-no-trains-on-liverpool-street-chingford-line-for-16-consecutive-days-this-summer
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Post by stapler on Apr 28, 2024 14:12:41 GMT
When this sort of thing happened before - eg the landslip on the incline out of Walthamstow C in ?1979, a shuttle was run between Chingford and W cent, to ensure connections with the Victoria Line. Nowadays not worth bothering? Longer term, another reason to re-lay the Hall Farm Curve....
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towerman
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Post by towerman on Apr 28, 2024 16:58:08 GMT
Just a query is the crossing still in situ at Walthamstow Central?
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Post by Chris M on Apr 28, 2024 21:14:12 GMT
Carto Metro shows a trailing crossover south of Walthamstow Central, and a pair of crossovers between Clapton and Clapton Junction.
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Dom K
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Post by Dom K on Apr 29, 2024 8:11:07 GMT
The Enfield Town and Cheshunt services during this closure are working to a different timetable (which pretty much swaps the timings around) there are no peak extras during this time either, but I expect that all trains will be 8 carriages at all times (which is needed especially at weekends).
As an example at Seven Sisters on a normal day, off peak the trains are 18/48 for Enfield Town and 03/33 for Cheshunt.
During the closure this will change to 05/35 for Enfield Town and 21/51 for Cheshunt services. This pattern I prefer as it suits my travel plans better!
At first glance, it doesn’t appear the Greater Anglia timings have been inputting into the timetable yet
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Post by spsmiler on Apr 29, 2024 13:33:35 GMT
A section of railway closing because a bridge needs replacing is understandable, and doing this type of work during the school holidays when fewer passengers travel is not unusual, but its still very bad that passengers are being abandoned ... "go away, we just do not care about your need to travel to work, other destinations, etc"
BOO!
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Post by d7666 on Apr 29, 2024 21:26:57 GMT
This subject been discussed on other forum ..... and the subject of shuttle from Chingford. I am not 100& certain but as I have posted there, I think the entire Chingford branch from Copper Mill is one 25 kV OLE electrical section, and is the same section through Clapton. Bridge renewal above tracks almost certainly has the OLE off => no trains at all the whole branch. Where it was cited before, a shuttle for a landslip, that would not necessarily need to have the OLE off. But. Repeat. I am not 100% sure of the OLE sections, just 90% ![:)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/smiley.png) it was in the past, but could have been altered since 1990s. And how at he moment, 3 months ahead, without seeing the FULL altered main line and bus timetables, is anyone jumping to the "passengers abandoned" conclusion ?
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Post by Chris M on Apr 30, 2024 9:03:06 GMT
Another thing to consider is that although the headline works are at Clapton there may be other works taking place that can only be done during a line closure on other parts of the branch at the same time.
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Post by brigham on May 1, 2024 7:44:43 GMT
One would hope that best use would be made of the closure. If not, shuttles could be run as mentioned above, but with non-electric stock.
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Post by Chris M on May 1, 2024 10:04:52 GMT
What non-electric stock? Do you have drivers that are trained on both it and the route? Can it be maintained at (presumably) Chingford? A quick look at the Wikipedia article suggests that the last time diesel trains ran in regular passenger service to Chingford was circa 1960.
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Post by d7666 on May 1, 2024 19:56:51 GMT
What non-electric stock? Do you have drivers that are trained on both it and the route? Can it be maintained at (presumably) Chingford? A quick look at the Wikipedia article suggests that the last time diesel trains ran in regular passenger service to Chingford was circa 1960. Indeed. Or diesels re-fuelled where ? And where in any case would such diesel trains come from ? Heritage / preserved ? To work with what rolling stock ? Perhaps the next suggestion is to bring in some main line approved steam locos too ? With what stock ? By what crews ? And we don't yet have enough competent battery trains anywhere to do anything useful - unless some one is going suggest LU engineers battery locos ? While one could along with that as an entertainment idea - and one can underline a few more of them for haulage - one doubts it could be practical. Never mind where they could re-charge. Or driven by who ? And so on. All this is why (in general) they run buses.
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Post by tjw on May 2, 2024 15:53:30 GMT
All this is why (in general) they run buses. Because it is far safer (for the railway and no one else) to use a bus and a driver that can be trusted to drive any route, magically avoiding low bridges, trees and other moving obstructions... Don't tell DafT though they will see another opportunity to make the railways safer. Daft = Department of Transport
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Post by brigham on May 4, 2024 7:29:10 GMT
Once again, the increasing inflexibility of rail transport comes to the fore.
It was a great thing in its day.
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Post by starlight73 on May 4, 2024 14:10:41 GMT
Carto Metro shows a trailing crossover south of Walthamstow Central A commentator called “Lord Voldemort” on ianVisits said the Walthamstow Central crossover is unsignalled and controlled by a ground frame (i.e. physical lever next to the points). This article article has some helpful map views of the site I’ll update this post if I can find anything about other works at the time. Update: I think d7666 is right and the whole branch is in one OLE section. As of 2015, the only neutral section (I.e. the only gap between OLE sections) is very close to the start of the branch at Clapton. you can see this info by searching CJC on this railwaycodes.org page. (CJC is the Engineer’s Line Reference, or ELR, for the branch). The neutral section is at 4 miles 46 chains and the start of the branch is 4 miles 38 chains
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Post by tut on May 4, 2024 14:44:38 GMT
The crossover at Walthamstow Central is indeed in place and is worked from a ground frame.
There is no conceivable reason in terms of signalling infrastructure that it could not be used.
The Sectional Appendix shows the OHNS at 4m 46ch and Clapton Junction at 4m 37ch. There is only one OHNS shown on the branch.
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Post by starlight73 on May 5, 2024 4:59:21 GMT
Thanks tut - I’ve corrected a typo in my post This shows the OLE has to be off for the whole branch during works. And while it would be nice to use diesels there are probably issues like: - cost of leasing them - maybe no suitable diesels currently off-lease (there’s withdrawn class 153s, HSTs and 230s, none of which sounds suitable ![:D](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/grin.png) ) - Overground drivers wouldn’t be trained on them - Loco haulage: class 710s are probably not set up to receive power from a loco which rules it out
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Post by spsmiler on May 5, 2024 11:18:18 GMT
I wonder, would passengers appreciate the comfort of the HST?
These would attract railway enthusiasts wanting to experience an HST on 'rare track'.
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Post by Chris M on May 5, 2024 12:39:03 GMT
Are HSTs really comfortable for journeys of four miles end-to-end with two intermediate stops? They're intercity trains designed for long journeys with 2-10 minute stops at each station, there is no way they could keep to a timetable designed for 710s even if they fit.
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Post by Dom K on May 5, 2024 17:45:43 GMT
We seem to be flirting with FRIPAS territory. I think it’s safe to say that no diesel trains will be heading down to Chingford for a variety of reasons. However that’s not what the topic is about. Thanks
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Post by d7666 on May 5, 2024 18:31:49 GMT
We seem to be flirting with FRIPAS territory. I think it’s safe to say that no diesel trains will be heading down to Chingford for a variety of reasons. However that’s not what the topic is about. Thanks FRIPAS ? What means that ? ![???](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/huh.png) Not in this forum's list of abbreviations and - tut tut moderator ![:P](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/tongue.png) - not explained in the post. (And google can't find that one either; well not for me).
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Post by d7666 on May 5, 2024 18:35:08 GMT
The crossover at Walthamstow Central is indeed in place and is worked from a ground frame. There is no conceivable reason in terms of signalling infrastructure that it could not be used. But is this crossover 25 kV wired ? Not /signalling/ I agree, but certainly infrastructure. Since the route has been LO certain bits of infrastructure have been isolated / removed e.g. the Chingford platforms loco release ground frame is still there - but not connected to anything - the switch crossings have been plain lined (well they were in January 2024 when I looked). On the whole though I think people need to give it up on creative (or otherwise) suggestions. The line is blocked, live with it.
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Dom K
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Post by Dom K on May 5, 2024 18:35:30 GMT
We seem to be flirting with FRIPAS territory. I think it’s safe to say that no diesel trains will be heading down to Chingford for a variety of reasons. However that’s not what the topic is about. Thanks FRIPAS ? What means that ? ![???](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/huh.png) Not in this forum's list of abbreviations and - tut tut moderator ![:P](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/tongue.png) - not explained in the post. (And google can't find that one either; well not for me). FRIPAS - Fantasy Railway Ideas, Proposals and Suggestions
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Post by imran on May 12, 2024 8:42:10 GMT
Another thing to consider is that although the headline works are at Clapton there may be other works taking place that can only be done during a line closure on other parts of the branch at the same time. Exactly! There may be some other work going on during the closure. That way passengers don’t have to face more disruption to services in the future.
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Post by Dom K on May 12, 2024 10:40:03 GMT
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Post by roythebus on Jun 18, 2024 20:01:03 GMT
Rail replacement buses will be supplied by Sullivan Buses. They have the contract for seemingly all the closures on this line until September, including late night closures, week-long and weekend closures.
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Post by imran on Jul 23, 2024 9:41:10 GMT
We’re a few days into the closure. Just thought I quickly add a few things:
A rail replacement bus service is in operation between Hackney Downs & Chingford calling at all intermediate stations.
Buses on routes 97, 212, 230 & 275 will likely be busier than usual.
Seven Sisters Station will also likely be more busier.
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Post by Chris M on Jul 23, 2024 14:10:03 GMT
There were announcements I half-heard about a one-way system being in operation at Seven Sisters at peak times. As early Sunday morning is very much not peak time and I'm only a very occasional user of the station I didn't spot anything obvious when I was there.
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Post by imran on Jul 24, 2024 17:08:22 GMT
There were announcements I half-heard about a one-way system being in operation at Seven Sisters at peak times. As early Sunday morning is very much not peak time and I'm only a very occasional user of the station I didn't spot anything obvious when I was there. Yep! That what it says in the press release, that Seven Sisters will operate a one-way system during peak hours Mondays to Fridays. Likely to prevent overcrowding.
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Post by jimbo on Jul 24, 2024 21:33:00 GMT
One-way where? To street exits? Or in the west end and out the east end, perhaps?
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Post by imran on Jul 27, 2024 8:38:55 GMT
One-way where? To street exits? Or in the west end and out the east end, perhaps? It doesn’t make it clear, I assume it’s exit & interchange only during peak hours.
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