Pudding Mill Lane

[davidp]

Just a heads up really to anyone who didn't know but Pudding Mill Lane station closes after tonight (Friday 13th July) and won't reopen until Wednesday 12th September after the Paralympics have finished.

I can understand why it would be deemed necessary to close this station during the games since it couldn't possibly cope with the volume of traffic it may attract, but does anyone know why it needs to close 13 days in advance of the Opening Ceremony?

[Deleted]

I think it falls within the Olympic 'cordon' - security and all that.

[Deleted]

Fairly obvious, so that on Monday 30 July people aren't expecting to get on and off there. You can put up as many signs as you like but I'll guarantee that no one reads them and come Monday you'd have loads of angry passengers complaining that there was no warning of this.

Or am I just being cynical.......

[Jerome H]

Actually you make sense. I'm sure that if you tell people the station is closed ahead of time, you don't get all the complaints. Are they reopening on the same station or the new one?

[Deleted]

I was joking but seriously the punters really are that stupid, so glad I'm not working stations, it's going to be hell out there......

[rsdworker]

they are rebuilding station - its moved from area where crossrail portals are - its was mentioned in one of thread somewhere here

[Deep Level]

They aren't rebuilding it just yet, this closure is simply for the Olympics and then the new station will be start to be built afterwards and then the old station demolished once finished.

[snoggle]

Jul 13, 2012 20:10:28 GMT Deep Level said:

They aren't rebuilding it just yet, this closure is simply for the Olympics and then the new station will be start to be built afterwards and then the old station demolished once finished.

The new station is actually under construction but the work is paused for the Games. It will be a fair number of months before the new alignment and station are ready to take trains.

[Deep Level]

Anyone know if DLR have decided to use this as an excuse to double track the whole section between Bow Church and Stratford? I know they were thinking about it but not decided on.

[alholmes]

No - there are still no plans to double the track apart from at Pudding Mill Lane station.

[crusty54]

Jul 14, 2012 0:45:18 GMT Deep Level said:

Anyone know if DLR have decided to use this as an excuse to double track the whole section between Bow Church and Stratford? I know they were thinking about it but not decided on.

not enough space on the bend between Pudding Mill Lane and Bow Church stations

[Deep Level]

Well I'm sure space can be made, hence why building works take time because things have to change. If everyone just based decisions on what already exists then nothing would be built.

As far as I know the new viaduct and station will be double tracked as far as where it reaches the already existing sections on either side, this only leaves 2 quite small single track sections.

[Chris M]

I was certainly under the impression that Pudding Mill Lane to Stratford would be doubled as this was regarded as the biggest bottleneck on the network.
The actual bend between PML and Bow Church would be more difficult to double, but probably not physical impossible. Whether it would be economically possible or not I don't know.

[alholmes]

A few years ago a new apartment building was built beside and fairly close to the DLR track, between the bridges over the A12 and Fairfield Road. I wrote to the DLR at the time of the planning application, to ensure that they were aware as it would appear to rule out the possibility of widening in future. They were aware of the plans but saw no reason to object.

The plans for the new PML show the new viaduct to be double track, but, not plans exist for widening of the existing sections.

[Deleted]

I've no problem as such with the singled sections; being the end of the route the need for doubling isn't as critical as other, busier sections of the DLR network, though it's obviously desirable (but costly, given there's no more space on the viaduct shared with Anglia services; especially the section that travels over the A12).

This new station viaduct is double track for all what has been constructed so far, so if it stays doubled until joining the existing trackbed at either end, that'll be more double track on the station approach than at present, which would allow trains waiting to leave Pudding Mill Lane earlier and help keep to time.

At the moment a 6 minute headway is, from what I've seen, the best frequency that stays reliable; 5 min headways normally lead to waiting at Bow Church. With the rebuilt Pudding Mill Lane, depending on how far the station approach travels, a reliable 5 min service might be possible.

After the Olympic Park is built out, a higher frequency may well be needed and the track doubled as much as can be done (Bow Church curve being the obvious exclusion).

[Jerome H]

So for now is Pudding Mill Lane just a placing place on the road to Stratford?
If only they could use the old Platform 4 at Stratford, they could really use the DLR well during the Games

[Deleted]

Jul 14, 2012 17:25:10 GMT Jerome H said:

So for now is Pudding Mill Lane just a placing place on the road to Stratford?
If only they could use the old Platform 4 at Stratford, they could really use the DLR well during the Games

I would imagine that re-opening Platform 4 would be quite expensive and utterly redundant after the Games. There is also the question of whether they'd have enough trains available to fill all three platforms.

Another reason why Pudding Mill Lane is closed is that it is actually within the Olympic Park, only ticket holders will be allowed into the Park so you'd need a ticket just to get off.

Something I noticed, Custom House will be exit only while Prince Regent will be entrance only. Now I can understand how you stop people entering a station thus making it exit only but just how do you stop people getting off a train and leaving a station? When I worked on stations I never was asked to do this, any suggestions?

[Chris M]

You almost certainly can't stop people getting off a train, but you can arrange station passages etc to make it very difficult for them to exit (always going against flow) which is how the entrance building at Tower Hill is organises iirc. Obviously the station will have to be able to funtion as an exit in an emergency.

[Deleted]

I see G4S staff/squaddies on the platform with cattle prods lying in wait for anyone who dares to get off..............

[Deleted]

Jul 15, 2012 15:00:21 GMT aslefshrugged said:

I see G4S staff/squaddies on the platform with cattle prods lying in wait for anyone who dares to get off..............

There won't be any of them to spare for such purposes - or was the great increase in numbers specially for that?

[Jerome H]

Jul 15, 2012 6:22:39 GMT aslefshrugged said:

Another reason why Pudding Mill Lane is closed is that it is actually within the Olympic Park, only ticket holders will be allowed into the Park so you'd need a ticket just to get off.

Is Pudding Mill Lane the only station within the Park?

[Deep Level]

I believe Stratford International is classed as being inside the Olympic Park although the security cordons will go around it and Westfield Stratford City. Hackney Wick is just on the border.

[Deleted]

If Westfield were inside the Park that would mean a serious slump in sales as only ticket holders would be allowed to shop.

[Deleted]

Jul 16, 2012 7:19:20 GMT aslefshrugged said:

If Westfield were inside the Park that would mean a serious slump in sales as only ticket holders would be allowed to shop.

From what I've been told, the cordon has been specially planned so that normal shopping is disrupted as little as possible, so you should still be able to get in to Westfield without a ticket.

[Deep Level]

Jul 16, 2012 7:19:20 GMT aslefshrugged said:

If Westfield were inside the Park that would mean a serious slump in sales as only ticket holders would be allowed to shop.

Yes but as I mentioned previously, the security cordon will go around it.

[causton]

Jul 16, 2012 16:03:58 GMT @ltmuseumguy said:

Jul 16, 2012 7:19:20 GMT aslefshrugged said:

If Westfield were inside the Park that would mean a serious slump in sales as only ticket holders would be allowed to shop.

From what I've been told, the cordon has been specially planned so that normal shopping is disrupted as little as possible, so you should still be able to get in to Westfield without a ticket.

Just not in your Chelsea Tractor ;D

[Jerome H]

As far as I've read, Pudding Mill Lane is not adapted for 3 car trains, however I'm sure the passing is. I think it's interesting how quickly the points have to be changed as the trains are longer than the last time pudding mill was a passing place.

[rsdworker]

Jul 17, 2012 2:42:39 GMT Jerome H said:

As far as I've read, Pudding Mill Lane is not adapted for 3 car trains, however I'm sure the passing is. I think it's interesting how quickly the points have to be changed as the trains are longer than the last time pudding mill was a passing place.

the new one will be 3 car ability - but old one isn't able to have 3 cars because no new extension built

[Deleted]

Pudding Mill Lane westbound can take 3-vehicle trains as it was lengthened at the east (Stratford) end.

The eastbound (towards Stratford) cannot, where trains operate with "selective door opening" (SDO) as also at Cutty Sark, Elverson Road, Gallions Reach and Royal Albert.

One would assume that the new PML will be 3-vehicles long for both directions.

[Antje]

Pudding Mill Lane can be open for the Olympics, only if it was big enough. But it is only a small island with a small ticket hall, and it is tempting for tourists to get off at the nearest station possible and jam up the narrow passageway.