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Post by superteacher on Nov 6, 2018 14:41:04 GMT
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Post by aslefshrugged on Nov 6, 2018 14:55:31 GMT
I worked on stations for five years before I transferred to trains and very little of my experience during that time helped me as a Train Operator apart from being used to making PAs. The only advantage of hiring from within that I can see is that recruits will be used to shift work and travelling across London in staff taxis for dead late finishes or dead early starts.
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Chris M
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Post by Chris M on Nov 6, 2018 15:11:01 GMT
There is an argument that "coming up through the ranks" gives you the experience of how the railway works, which makes you a better TOp. Lack of experience, and skimped training, were thought to be factors in the Ladbroke Grove disaster, the driver had no railway experience before being recruited earlier the same year. (Conversely one can argue that the job suits such a different type of personality that it's best to recruit specifically for the role). I can understand how Guard to Motorman was a logical progression with transferable skills, but less so from stations - especially as from what I understand recruits to stations these days get almost no training in things that might be termed "railway culture" and with staffing levels cut to the bone and communication between the various departments seemingly nearly non-existent they have little opportunity to learn it on the job unless they specifically hunt it down in their own time in places like this forum. |
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Post by superteacher on Nov 6, 2018 17:26:46 GMT
I see the usual fake news is going around, linking this strike to a sacked driver who allegedly opened train doors in a tunnel.
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Post by aslefshrugged on Nov 6, 2018 17:42:29 GMT
I see the usual fake news is going around, linking this strike to a sacked driver who allegedly opened train doors in a tunnel. The sacking was added to a load of grievances that have been brewing for months. It was the first train out of Hainault, the driver was doing a night duty, the train overshot Wanstead westbound in ATO by a car and a bit so he was wrong to open the doors. It was his first error in 25 years as a Train Op, his director's appeal was rejected on Friday and now its going to tribunal. |
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rincew1nd
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Post by rincew1nd on Nov 6, 2018 18:47:48 GMT
...his director's appeal was rejected on Friday and now its going to tribunal. Best that we don’t discuss an employment matter that is ongoing. Can we stick to trains please? |
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londoner
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Post by londoner on Nov 6, 2018 23:20:50 GMT
...his director's appeal was rejected on Friday and now its going to tribunal. Best that we don’t discuss an employment matter that is ongoing. Can we stick to trains please?Just let me get some duct tape  |
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Post by Chris M on Nov 7, 2018 0:21:59 GMT
Admin comment Best that we don’t discuss an employment matter that is ongoing. Can we stick to trains please? Just let me get some duct tape I think the Central line fleet maintenance have bought it all! |
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rincew1nd
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Post by rincew1nd on Nov 7, 2018 0:41:39 GMT
 Very droll. |
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Post by drainrat on Nov 7, 2018 10:11:48 GMT
Another bit of rubbish is the claim that the unions insist that only existing TfL/LUL staff can apply for train operators jobs, ASLEF actually would prefer new recruits from outside TfL as existing employees are most likely RMT members already There is an argument that "coming up through the ranks" gives you the experience of how the railway works, which makes you a better TOp. Lack of experience, and skimped training, were thought to be factors in the Ladbroke Grove disaster, the driver had no railway experience before being recruited earlier the same year. ( Conversely one can argue that the job suits such a different type of personality that it's best to recruit specifically for the role). Very pertinent point. I call it the 'train operator paradox'. Basically, the behaviours and mindsets picked up in order to do the job isn't the same as the ones looked for when they run their recruitment processes. Once you become a train operator - you start to become 'infected' by doing the job - you take on traits the company doesn't want when looking for new T/ops. Trouble is, the traits they look for are so wide of what's needed, seeing a fair few not hacking it I'm afraid. I'd say its Very similar to soldiers, who people want to go off to fight wars, yet don't want to deal with the aftermath of what the soldiers have to go through 😔 |
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Post by sawb on Nov 21, 2018 18:40:34 GMT
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rincew1nd
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Post by rincew1nd on Nov 21, 2018 19:10:32 GMT
Isn't it usually "don't book on between the hours of...."?
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Post by Dstock7080 on Dec 20, 2018 16:53:18 GMT
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londoner
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Post by londoner on Dec 20, 2018 16:58:05 GMT
For all the grief we give BBC and other news outlets for sensationalizing news stories regarding the railways, both TfL and the unions appear just as guilty of it.
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Post by superteacher on Dec 20, 2018 17:23:06 GMT
Good news. Would have really affected the Christmas shoppers. Glad that they were able to move forward.
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Post by philthetube on Dec 20, 2018 21:36:59 GMT
I wonder if we will find out what this sensitive information was.
I have said it before and I still believe it, if these negotiations were held in public then this sort of rubbish would not happen.
Both sides would have to play fair or look like idiots to the whole world.
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Post by norbitonflyer on Dec 20, 2018 22:42:18 GMT
I wonder if we will find out what this sensitive information was. I doubt it - that's what sensitive means. It seems a pity it wasn't shared with those who need to know sooner though. |
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Post by Chris M on Dec 20, 2018 23:07:27 GMT
I have said it before and I still believe it, if these negotiations were held in public then this sort of rubbish would not happen. Would you like details of your personal life, medical history, alleged transgressions, etc. discussed in public? Would you like to hear it selectively quoted and twisted so as to fit the agenda of newspapers, politicians? Would you like random commuters, who've misunderstood something they half heard on the radio, to be speculating about your fitness for a role they don't understand the full requirements of? Unless the answer to all of those questions is "yes" then you will probably want to reconsider your beliefs. |
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Post by philthetube on Dec 21, 2018 7:45:29 GMT
You would not need to name names, alleged transgressions should be discussed in public, this would show who is being reasonable, and who is spoiling for a fight. it is not needed to make public the name of the person concerned, however, in this case either the company has been playing games to try and discredit the unions or the unions have ignored something which they probably knew and have lied about it.
Had this been discussed in the open then large numbers of people would not have been inconvenienced by having to make alternative arrangements, which are not now needed, and, although not in this case a strike may have been averted.
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Post by piccboy on Dec 21, 2018 8:50:53 GMT
You would not need to name names, alleged transgressions should be discussed in public, this would show who is being reasonable, and who is spoiling for a fight. it is not needed to make public the name of the person concerned, however, in this case either the company has been playing games to try and discredit the unions or the unions have ignored something which they probably knew and have lied about it. Had this been discussed in the open then large numbers of people would not have been inconvenienced by having to make alternative arrangements, which are not now needed, and, although not in this case a strike may have been averted. In today's world of online social media, there can never be true anonymity. Wouldn't be long before a name was put to any case. Best that any sensitive details like Medical conditions, are kept private. |
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Post by Chris M on Dec 21, 2018 12:38:13 GMT
Also imagine the harm that would be done if the wrong name was associated with a case - particularly given that much of (social) media has an inability (or unwillingness) to distinguish between allegations and facts.
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Post by drainrat on Dec 21, 2018 12:50:10 GMT
For all the grief we give BBC and other news outlets for sensationalizing news stories regarding the railways, both TfL and the unions appear just as guilty of it. Keeping up with the Jones' 😂 I wonder if we will find out what this sensitive information was. I have said it before and I still believe it, if these negotiations were held in public then this sort of rubbish would not happen. Both sides would have to play fair or look like idiots to the whole world. I don't think people fully understand how these negotiations take place. It isn't 'all parties getting round the table', that moment is long passed by the time ACAS is used, ACAS is basically 'smoke signals and beacons' in comparison to getting round the table......'this sort of rubbish' is usually arrived at after years of negotiations at local, then higher levels, so I don't really understand how holding the negotiations in public would prevent it from happening, besides, at every stage of negotiation from level 1 meetings to Functional level meetings, minutes are provided for all to see, they're not hidden 😉 You would not need to name names, alleged transgressions should be discussed in public, this would show who is being reasonable, and who is spoiling for a fight. it is not needed to make public the name of the person concerned, however, in this case either the company has been playing games to try and discredit the unions or the unions have ignored something which they probably knew and have lied about it. Had this been discussed in the open then large numbers of people would not have been inconvenienced by having to make alternative arrangements, which are not now needed, and, although not in this case a strike may have been averted. It does get discussed in the open, they are called branch meetings and all union members are invited. Bottom line is this, I know exactly what has happened, but it's nigh on impossible to enter in to conversation about it with media brainwashed public whose first retort is to accuse me of the rubbish they read in the media, which is part of a narrative, all theatre that the British love so dearly 🙄 |
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Post by brigham on Dec 21, 2018 17:53:33 GMT
"...that the British love so dearly..."
The British as opposed to..?
Something Oscar Wilde would come out with, being Irish and all...
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Post by drainrat on Dec 21, 2018 18:49:16 GMT
Yes, no opposition....all you have to do is provide a stage, an act, a villain in the background and the British public will shout in unison "HE'S BEHIND YOU!" 😂
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Post by superteacher on Dec 22, 2018 0:39:27 GMT
Anyway, let’s not get into racial stereotyping. Back on topic please.
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Post by drainrat on Dec 22, 2018 19:51:47 GMT
National, cultural, possibly, racial, definitely not.
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Post by MoreToJack on Dec 22, 2018 19:56:58 GMT
Desist.
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Post by superteacher on Dec 22, 2018 19:58:57 GMT
National, cultural, possibly, racial, definitely not.
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Post by drainrat on Dec 22, 2018 20:00:00 GMT
But I would say stereotyping is a huge part of strike actions, they are in this one
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Post by drainrat on Dec 22, 2018 20:01:02 GMT
....in my knowledge of this, stereotyping is quite a part of it regarding the attendance procedures, and if I'm to try to give comment from my view, there will be a lot about stereotyping, also, how it is perceived by a wider audience and that audiences collective character (stereotype?) are taken in to consideration by both sides of the table, the sensation created by the media, from TfL is all because they know how things are taken by the larger community.
How many on here believed that tube drivers earn more than £100k per yr?.....hopefully people here are clued up enough to realise it was false reporting designed to elicit a response with an objective, but the vast majority believed it all, LBC even run a whole show on it which was covered by 2 DJs, who chose to ignore a lot of 'in the know' callers in favour of callers who wanted to attack us, they were annoyed by a lie, one perpetuated by Ferrari et al.
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