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Post by superteacher on May 15, 2018 7:30:50 GMT
The smaller displays are quite hard to read the full size version is far easier Agreed - they’re horrible. I wonder if the reason may be that they are some kind of attempt to make people spread along the platform, as the larger indicators can be read from anywhere and therefore people can just remain where they arrive on the platform. Well the new ones at Bank Central line are situated at the busiest part of the platform. Clearly your level of logic is not possessed by those who install them! |
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Post by crusty54 on May 15, 2018 8:57:23 GMT
Has anybody actually complained to TFL? It would be interesting to hear their response. Somebody should - I don't think they meet the station accessibility guidelines for mobility impaired persons. |
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Post by jamesb on May 15, 2018 21:26:12 GMT
There are examples of dot matrix boards getting obscured by other signage across the network over time, depending on your position on the platform.
I wonder why the dot matrix indicators can't be over the track, i.e. attached to the other wall, so that (when the train isn't in the platform) they are never obscured by anything. I can't quite visualise in my mind if they would be visible when a train was sitting underneath them though...
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Post by Deleted on May 15, 2018 23:01:32 GMT
There is no input from the signallers that has an effect on the describer boards, maybe the list we use for the Piccadilly's CTFS might influence the list and expected set numbers but there is no direct input per se If they are the same as they are elsewhere they use a clever interface between the timetable and Connect Radio data, which is why they're not always accurate. They can 'flip-flop' in the way that some of the legacy programme machines can but they can't account for additional trains, short trips or extensions - we await CBTC for that. There's nothing like us humans that tops knowing what's going on, last week an unscheduled tip out, turned up at Rayners W/B, another booked tip out and through Uxbridge are in the vicinity. Luckily I heard the station staff mention amongst themselves that another tip out was in next because it actually was the through Uxbridge and I knew it was the through train next as I was the one that routed it! |
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Post by Dstock7080 on May 21, 2018 11:14:17 GMT
Brackets have appeared for something at Ealing Broadway, we can only hope! Hornchurch has DMI WB Nothing at: Chiswick Park (both), Barons Court (EB), West Kensington (both), Upney (WB), Hornchurch (EB), Upminster. someone must’ve been reading, as new (currently non-working) DMis have appeared at Chiswick Park (both) ! Another example! Upney (both) now has new (currently non-working) DMi‘s |
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Post by Dstock7080 on May 23, 2018 5:33:54 GMT
someone must’ve been reading, as new (currently non-working) DMis have appeared at Chiswick Park (both) ! Another example! Upney (both) now has new (currently non-working) DMi‘s now West Kensington (both) now has new (currently non-working) small DMI‘s ! |
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Post by A60stock on May 25, 2018 16:40:17 GMT
Just noticed that the older wide style dmis of the central line resignalling era have been replaced by a much smaller one.
Is there any reason for replacing the older dmis? As far as i noticed, they were most certainly not out dated (unlike some older dmis such as those at baker street).
Seems like a waste of money for me. Also, theyre far smaller, how is this progress?!
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Post by Deleted on May 25, 2018 16:51:39 GMT
Making them all standard by the looks of it.
The are a off the shelf item as opposed to a LU specific
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Post by londonstuff on May 25, 2018 20:09:49 GMT
Just noticed that the older wide style dmis of the central line resignalling era have been replaced by a much smaller one. Is there any reason for replacing the older dmis? As far as i noticed, they were most certainly not out dated (unlike some older dmis such as those at baker street). Seems like a waste of money for me. Also, theyre far smaller, how is this progress?! Couldn’t agree more and as I intimated a few weeks ago, I really do have to question whether they’re fit for purpose as they’re next to illegible if you’re more than a few metres away. Given some of the Crossrail platforms will be twice as long, I wonder whether they’ll have an off-the-shelf product, something bespoke or whether they’ll reply on the screens above the PEDs. Admin Comment: Thread merge - there are now three thread about PEDs. I’ll merge this with one of the other and then see about the third - that’s turning more into a history of PEDs so will leave separate for now. |
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Post by A60stock on May 26, 2018 13:17:42 GMT
Does anyone know if the stations chorleywood, Chalfont, Amersham and Chesham have DMI's yet?
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class411
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Post by class411 on May 30, 2018 17:46:22 GMT
The new displays carry more information, but the display screens and consequently the font is too small and the locations of the signs are simply careless. It sometimes seems as if not one single iota of intelligence has been used in the placement of the describers. There are many stations where the describer is out of view for a lot of the length of the platform because they've plonked some other piece of platform ceiling furniture in the way, or placed the describer where it is blocked by some extant obstruction. |
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Post by Deleted on May 31, 2018 10:24:26 GMT
They have tried to keep them in the same place as the original sign for ease of cabling but the consequence of this is that unless you got perfect eyesight they are very hard to read if standing at the outer ends of the platform itself.
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Post by crusty54 on May 31, 2018 11:17:01 GMT
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Post by Deleted on May 31, 2018 11:25:40 GMT
There are many stations where the describer is out of view for a lot of the length of the platform because they've plonked some other piece of platform ceiling furniture in the way, or placed the describer where it is blocked by some extant obstruction. Bond Street (northbound Jubilee) is particularly bad for this - the platform is curved and there is a large fixed 'way out' sign about two yards in front of the describer... I always marvelled at this.  |
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Post by domh245 on May 31, 2018 11:58:25 GMT
Ahem "These standards do not apply to websites or dot matrix indicators" So clearly they have read their own design standards, and for completeness sake, the "London Underground Signs" standard directs people has this to say: "Train indicators, although strictly not part of the fixed-sign system, fall into the category of destination information. For details of all real-time information signs, refer to LUL engineering specification." That said, the real question should be why the rationale behind text sizes in the digital display standard doesn't apply to train indicators as well? |
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Post by crusty54 on May 31, 2018 12:19:47 GMT
Ahem "These standards do not apply to websites or dot matrix indicators" So clearly they have read their own design standards, and for completeness sake, the "London Underground Signs" standard directs people has this to say: "Train indicators, although strictly not part of the fixed-sign system, fall into the category of destination information. For details of all real-time information signs, refer to LUL engineering specification." That said, the real question should be why the rationale behind text sizes in the digital display standard doesn't apply to train indicators as well? I referred to the viewing distance chart in the document which also appears in the Signs Manual. The new displays do not meet the letter height requirements. It is a big shame that white out of black displays were not selected. Recently installed on some Southeastern stations. Much clearer. |
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Post by howda62 on Jun 1, 2018 17:05:44 GMT
Does anyone know if the stations chorleywood, Chalfont, Amersham and Chesham have DMI's yet? There's nothing yet at Amersham, Chalfont or Chorleywood, not sure about Chesham. |
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Post by goldenarrow on Jun 3, 2018 7:38:17 GMT
It appears that the wider style of DMI's in grey casing were discontinued late 2012/early 2013 with Blackfriars being one of the last to receive them after it's three year rebuild.
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Post by coyote on Jun 3, 2018 19:38:17 GMT
The older signs were made by Data Display to a LUL/Metronet specification that included many unused features like remote monitoring and extra thick shatterproof glass, their large size made them awkward to fit on platforms without obstructing other signs and cameras. The newer smaller signs are from the same company for about a tenth of the price.
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Post by superteacher on Jun 3, 2018 21:42:57 GMT
The older signs were made by Data Display to a LUL/Metronet specification that included many unused features like remote monitoring and extra thick shatterproof glass, their large size made them awkward to fit on platforms without obstructing other signs and cameras. The newer smaller signs are from the same company for about a tenth of the price. Hmmm, had an idea that cost cutting was part of the reason! |
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class411
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Post by class411 on Jun 4, 2018 6:37:29 GMT
The older signs were made by Data Display to a LUL/Metronet specification that included many unused features like remote monitoring and extra thick shatterproof glass, their large size made them awkward to fit on platforms without obstructing other signs and cameras. The newer smaller signs are from the same company for about a tenth of the price. Hmmm, had an idea that cost cutting was part of the reason! I suspect that most of the cost reduction would be down continual fall in the price of electronic components, and computer sub assemblies. |
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Post by crusty54 on Jun 4, 2018 9:51:01 GMT
Hmmm, had an idea that cost cutting was part of the reason! I suspect that most of the cost reduction would be down continual fall in the price of electronic components, and computer sub assemblies. Think it is probably down to buying an off the shelf design from Data Displays. Buying cheap is not always the best idea. |
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class411
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Post by class411 on Jun 4, 2018 9:56:35 GMT
I suspect that most of the cost reduction would be down continual fall in the price of electronic components, and computer sub assemblies. Think it is probably down to buying an off the shelf design from Data Displays. Buying cheap is not always the best idea. That would certainly save a hell of a lot. Really, though, they need to rethink the whole describer system from the ground up, bearing in mind the changes in the relative costs of various technologies. Given the extreme cheapness of LCD displays now, it would possibly be better to use a number of these along the platform, rather than relatively expensive dot matrix systems. |
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Post by AndrewPSSP on Jun 4, 2018 15:47:46 GMT
If they got an LCD that could display images etc. then that could also be really useful.
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Post by Chris M on Jun 4, 2018 16:03:10 GMT
Some of the newer LED dot matrix (I presume) displays at NR stations can display pictures. For example at Doncaster it showed a basic diagram of the train showing how full each carriage was. LCD displays would be more flexible though.
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Post by Dstock7080 on Jun 18, 2018 5:43:41 GMT
Barons Court all platforms now have new (currently non-working) small DMI‘s, so lightboxes going soon 😞
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Post by goldenarrow on Jun 18, 2018 7:39:11 GMT
Are the light boxes not protected under the terms of the listing like Gloucester Road?
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Post by Chris M on Jun 18, 2018 8:13:13 GMT
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Post by goldenarrow on Jul 15, 2018 15:39:11 GMT
Just spotted this at Monument replacing pre 2000 generation DMI's. Thankfully somebody has had the foresight to install two of these 1/3rd and 2/3rds down the platform respectively. The Northern line platforms also have the same set up with the legacy DMI's yet to be removed.  |
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Post by coyote on Jul 15, 2018 16:35:07 GMT
Just spotted this at Monument replacing the 1st/2nd generation DMI's" The original signs on the District platforms were mk 3 from IGG, the Northern line had mk 1 signs from Thorn EMI. |
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